How You Become Prey to a Charmer/Abuser-Part 1
 

It opened for me. Thanks, MsSparkie---good info!

Thanks Brianna. That information was important for me to learn. The other part was that when involved with an addict (my ex was an alcoholic) that if you aid them in any way so they can keep using, you are an "enabler". I learned that word in Al-Anon....the AA group for families of alcohics.

They insisted that if you are handling the problems of their addictions for them, the complications, making sure that the damage they do to their lives, jobs, family, health, etc. are aided by you so it's not so devasting for him/her, then you are an "enabler" and are participating in their addiction. You must turn your back on them, let them lose their jobs, their health, their lives if so be, but let them suffer the consequences of their actions, without leaning on you and smothering you with their problem with no respect or appreciation. I could go on and on.....

It's about being "co-dependent".

A blind doormat.

Makes me upset to remember those days. If only I had known what I was doing. If I had not been a child of alcoholics.

But, whew! I know it all now.

Could never happen again.

:-)

She certainly is long winded. :rolleyes:

Bruce
You keep shooting me down??????? What's up with that?

That article was written by a lady who had a very terrible childhood.
It was not written by me.

Why don't you get off my back and read it?

She was abused by her father all her child life, he was a single
parent, dressed her in long dresses and boots, cut her hair short
and ragged...didn't want anyone else to want her.

It ended when she ran to her Uncles farm to escape him, (in south USA)
and he knew what was happening but said to her you better go home
there is nothing he could do. Her father had been shooting at her
with a shotgun as she was running away.

She went home he threatened to rape her with the shotgun. By then
she had no where to go for help, was so depressed and angry that
she said to him, go ahead and shoot me, I'd rather die than ever have
you touch me again.

His jaw dropped and she said she saw a change in him eyes. She had
touched a nerve.

That night he shot and killed himself.

Now she is one of the best counsellors I have ever met.

Like a lot of forums, there is a "clique" amongst the posters who have gotten to know each other and others have to fight tooth and claw to get in, pass the fire test.

Not sure I want to bother. I have seen many threads where a new person joins in a they are totally ignored.

Bruce, I would prefer that you just ignore me.

LOL

You'll have to elaborate on that because I don't know what you're talking about.
You said that in your first post.
Since you haven't explained just how I'm on your back that's very difficult.
Must be my lack of heaping accolades on your ultimate solution to "Charmer/Abuser"s?
I have read it, twice as a matter of fact.
A sad childhood is experience in one situation, not credentials.
That may be true, I have no way to judge her counseling ability, only comment on what you posted which I suspect is advice on a specific situation.
As general advice, I would question a number of points she made.

And, she was long winded. :chill:

If you know that level of information about your counsellor, s/he is not a good counsellor.

I think that the main problem is that many of you are prey to all this pseudo-psychological bunkum . You bandy words and expressions like 'co-dependent' ' charmer/abuser' , 'enabler' around . You speak of 'counsellors' , and I bet you know loads more words and expressions like that . I heard ' passive / aggressive' from an American the other day too ....

I find this very strange . It is as though you have to fit yourselves and other people into these pre-defined categories . People are far more interesting and complex than this , and personally I would not go near a shrink or a psychologist if you paid me . I have always found the idea of being told what I think , or what other people are , perfectly horrifying . I know what I think , and I deal with people as I come across them . People are people , not clinical cases .

I hope what I have just said may be useful to the doubtful and worried amongst you . I meant it to be helpful , not critical .

You might be interested in a little essay I wrote a while back (I get long winded, too). ;)

The main problem you are having with this is ignorance. In Computer Science we have named Design Patterns such as Strategy and Adapter. In Geometry people discuss 'right angle', it has a definition, it has properties you can do things with, you know its limits.

People that are 'co-dependent' don't often see the pattern until it is pointed out to them. It is a real pattern with commonalities that can be recognized and solutions that can be applied. Sure people are all different, that's what makes it harder than Geometry.

I am DEFINITELY a narcissistic psychopath then . Or should that be a psychopathic narcissist ?

Don't take it personally. He does that for sport. Kinda cross between Devil's Advocate and Mr. Spock. Take it in stride and shoot back playfully.

I'll have to claim ignorance on this terminology as it rarely comes up in addiction recovery disussions.

To me, this is like saying a house is just a house or a car is just a car. If you care only for its utilitarian aspect, then I suppose you'd be correct. But for those who are interested in the history, style, aesthetics, or performance, there is much more to it.

The human personality and mind is indeed complex and fascinating. Labeling various aspects of it is partly due to our attempt to understand it. Understanding something is necessary in order to modify it effectively, whether it be a 6 cyl engine, an A frame cabin or a bad human habit.

Stormie

Chalk another one up for us mere mortals with our feet on the ground. :thumbsup:

MsSparkie,

Seems like some of us new commers bring alot of baggage along when we don't really need them. Not here at the cellar. Seems like there is two types. Those of us who may feel defensive , like me , or those who bring hostility veiled as condesension. You'll notice by them displaying arrogance by patronizing those considered inferior ( which is everyone) and it's not Bruce.

Pretty hefty accusation there.

I think he means that he only cares about himself and sees people as objects to be manipulated. Actually, I think that once you apply the label "psychopath," "narcissist" becomes redundant.

The greater likelihood is that he is neither.

Wow! at first I thought of many things to say. Both after reading the EXTREMELY Long Winded essay, and then also after the claws came out by several. Now I think I'll just shut my already too big mouth and duck for cover.

Chicken. :p

OK I'll jump in with my 2 cents worth. First, living beings cannot be compartmentalized like inanimate objects. However, we all have tendencies and with all of those tendencies come exceptions. The whole issue to me comes back to communication. We all communicate very differently and what one person sends as constructive criticism, harmless banter or even "dry humor is received as a personal attack. None of this really means anything in the grand scheme of things, but after a few of these "issues" one individual will lash out and then the war has begun. What this thread needs now is a mediator - any candidates? Volunteers? :boxers: :3way:

Oh yeah and about the Abuser/charmer thing. . . . I have less than nothing to say on the subject. My "soon to be ex" was really good at it or so I thought. Then once away, l realized that l let her do many things and made excuses for her behavior all the time - I was more at fault for putting up with it than she for doing it.

I've calmed down since I posted that, as I was worried about my ex and his prostate cancer. Now we know for sure...it seems easier to face.

But Bruce seemed to be following me around with those shaking head icons at my posts there for a while, and it was starting to bug me! LOL
:headshake :headshake :headshake :headshake :headshake :headshake :headshake :headshake :headshake :headshake :headshake :headshake

He has since stopped. Thanks Brucey!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:jig: :nuts: :beer:

The fuck I have. :headshake

To continue in this vein....(just for fun, I really do love men!)

Men Online – Hall of Shame


The Player
This guy just sends out messages & chats online practically full time. As soon as he gets you in the sack, he’s on to his next conquest. He’s slick, I hope you recognize him. In retrospect you are quite relieved you insisted on a condom despite the intense pressure and questionable “latex allergy” excuse.

The Instant Relationship Guy
This guy tells you all sorts of bs: “I met you & pulled my profile” “Where have you been all my life” “I want to take you on my business trip to Europe with me” “I’m falling for you” “I think you’re going to marry me” “You’re so amazing”, etc etc. Wear hip waders, the shit is deep.

The Liar
Similar to the above guy, but these types are more creative, with a wider range of lies: they will lie about their age, height (like I wouldn’t notice??), where they live, marital status, job, whether they smoke or not, whether they have kids or not, if they are dating someone else, etc. Don’t forget the classic: “I’ll call you”. Basically, you can tell if they are lying – their lips are moving. They are the most common type found online.

The Dumb Guy
Poor bastard couldn’t spell if his life depended on it. Too clueless to run spell check on his 5 sentence profile. “I like purty gurls.” No punctuation. Even misspells his profession – how scary is that?

The One Good Picture Guy
Just has one good picture from the right angle that makes him look acceptably cute. Does not look like that at all in person. Frustrating when you had agreed to meet him for dinner & it ends up Dutch. He should pay just for the inconvenience of his misrepresentation.

The Ugly Guy That Wants a Supermodel
Annoying… the guy somehow reached 35 not knowing that he is a 4 out of 10. Constantly sends emails and instant messages the hot chicks, the 7 to 10’s out of 10. Would never have the courage to approach them out in public, subconsciously knows they are out of his league. WHY don’t you want to date me? Sorry, you’re not my type. What’s your type? etc etc. Invariably from Sticksville.

The Intolerant Guy
This guy is abusive if you don’t agree with his religious beliefs, etc. or will tell you that you are weird if there is something about you that he doesn’t understand. An insensitive prick. Doesn’t really like women that have opinions – on anything.

The Sketchy Guy
The only thing you find out about this guy is his licence plate number & cel number. You will date this guy quite a few times but will never find out any personal information about the elusive sketchy guy. You’ll never know his last name, see where he lives, or know where he works. You’ll never meet any of his friends, coworkers or family. Nothing, nada, zilch, zippo. You’ll wonder if he did exist at all.

The Retro In A Bad Way Guy
I think it’s the moustache from hell!! This guy desperately needs a Queer Eye makeover. Hasn’t shopped for new clothes in so long that he’s a sad case. Has potential, if you have the patience. I don’t. Been there, done that. Bought the t-shirt. (well, made him buy it.)

The Bitter Divorced Guy
This guy bitches about his ex, how she spent all his money, he never gets to see his kids, she cheated, she was such a cow, never gave him a blow job, etc etc. Waiter, bucket full o’ bitter, please. This guy is devoid of any positive thoughts, and emotionally unavailable. Suitable for dating robots.

The Dad
Unfortunately the only time this guy gets to see his kids is on the weekends, which coincides with when you want to go out and have a fun date with him. Always says “my beautiful 4 yr old”, etc. Why doesn’t anyone ever say, “my ugly little brat with behavioural problems”. Indulges his children’s every whim because of divorce guilt. Unfortunately the ex does too, and Junior pays the price.

The No Sex Drive Guy
Good sex at first but then loses interest. Forgets to mention that he is now on anti depressants, which has killed his sex drive completely. Don’t take it personally - the Limp Noodle is not because of you. Good thing you stumbled upon them in the bathroom cabinet when you were looking for a Q-tip.

The Cell Phone/Blackberry Guy
So attached to his device he doesn’t even know how to turn it off. Face has odd green glow from peering over that little screen every time you aren’t looking, go to the washroom, etc. This shifty eyed techno addict has the attention span of a mosquito. Usually jumpy and hopped up on coffee too.

The Horny Webcam Guy
Very soon into your chat with horny guy, he’ll suggest that you chat on camera, show you his abs, and ask if you have a camera. Never seems to actually date, always online looking for fresh fantasy material.

The Freaky Foot Fetish Guy
2 seconds into chatting he will ask you what your feet look like. After 2 polite questions feigning interest in your profession/personality/picture, asks if you like your feet worshipped, licked, or covered with cum. A tad too intimate too soon.

Being venal? ;)

Did ya read it Brucey? What was the seventh word in the 14th sentence? LOL

Venal? new word to me:

venal \VEE-nuhl\, adjective:
1. Capable of being bought or obtained for money or other valuable consideration; held for sale; salable; purchasable.
2. Capable of being corrupted.
3. Marked by or associated with bribery and corrupt dealings.

Are you going to bribe me? Candy?

No candy, you've already been corrupted. :p

Waaaaahhhhh...I want an all day sucker....and I want it now!!!!

...brave, brave lady