'Public' online spaces don't carry speech, rights

busterb · 07-06-2008, 07:34 PM

This should bring Radar out. Too long to post.
NEW YORK (AP) - Rant all you want in a public park. A police officer generally won't eject you for your remarks alone, however unpopular or provocative.
Say it on the Internet, and you'll find that free speech and other constitutional rights are anything but guaranteed.
HERE

xoxoxoBruce · 07-07-2008, 03:45 AM

Just shut up and do what the corporate overlords dictate.

SteveDallas · 07-07-2008, 08:47 AM

The problem is that hypothetical park is public land, maintained by the government at least partly with tax dollars for the benefit of the citizenry.

Those Yahoo servers are owned, operated, and paid for by Yahoo.

One of the most long-standing principles of The Internet is that you can generally do whatever you want on your own network. A recent example of this was a court case (in Texas?) where a spammer sued a university for blocking emails the spammer had sent to students. The court ruled that it was OK for the university to do that. I'm as much of a first amendment partisan as the next guy, but I wouldn't be thrilled if it suddenly became illegal for my employer to operate a spam blocker.

(The role of actual ISPs as common carriers--or not--is admittedly somewhat murkier, but that's another discussion I don't have time to wade into right now.)

Radar · 07-07-2008, 02:55 PM

I've always known that private property is private property. For instance, the cellar belongs to UT. He alone can set standards for those who post on his board. Though this would normally severely limit the size of your online community.

When I was running for congress a couple of years ago, I mentioned that I flag messages that violate the terms of use and someone got upset because they said, "Libertarians aren't against free speech".

I had to explain to them that Craig Numark owns craigslist and he has the right to set standards for its use...which he has done. He has also given the community the ability to flag offensive messages. I told them, if they want free speech, they should open their own website, but even then, their provider could choose not to host certain kinds of websites.

The only way for it to be truly free is for you to have your own fiber lines and switches going into the internet. Other than very large businesses and colleges, I don't know anyone who has something like that.

TheMercenary · 07-07-2008, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Radar

When I was running for congress a couple of years ago.

lookout123 · 07-07-2008, 04:39 PM

It is fairly well documented Merc. Radar may have some ideas coming from far left field but he does get out and do something for those ideas. he isn't just hot air and bombastic declarations.

Radar · 07-07-2008, 02:57 PM

I've had arguments with people who refer to themselves as "owners" of groups on Yahoo. I have explained to them that they don't own anything and that Yahoo owns the servers, switches, and even the words left on those groups by people.

busterb · 07-07-2008, 06:25 PM

Hate to say it, but true.

deadbeater · 07-12-2008, 06:16 PM

It could be worse; the US Defense Department could intervene and decree that only pro-military remarks are allowed to be posted, imaged, and disseminated. After all, they invented the Internet.

Damn; had they done that, there would be no easy expansion of terrorism. But then there would be no free porn. Choices, choices. No porn or or allow porn, and terorrism.

SamIam · 07-12-2008, 06:46 PM

I thought UT invented the Internet.

xoxoxoBruce · 07-12-2008, 07:52 PM

No, Al Gore invented it, UT is just the king.

TheMercenary · 07-14-2008, 10:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

No, Al Gore invented it, UT is just the king.

yea, well that and global warming.

richlevy · 07-14-2008, 07:43 PM

I remember being censored on Prodigy a long time ago. I asked on what grounds I was being censored, and an employee wrote that I could be censored for making negative comments about Prodigy or its advertisers.

I canceled the service immediately.

Sundae · 07-14-2008, 08:15 PM

You were censored for being a firestarter, twisted firestarter?

monster · 07-14-2008, 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sundae Girl

You were censored for being a firestarter, twisted firestarter?

07-06-2008, 07:34 PM	#1
busterb NSABFD Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: MS. usa Posts: 3,908	'Public' online spaces don't carry speech, rights This should bring Radar out. Too long to post. NEW YORK (AP) - Rant all you want in a public park. A police officer generally won't eject you for your remarks alone, however unpopular or provocative. Say it on the Internet, and you'll find that free speech and other constitutional rights are anything but guaranteed. HERE __________________ I've haven't left very deep footprints in the sands of time. But, boy I've left a bunch.

07-07-2008, 03:45 AM	#2
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	Just shut up and do what the corporate overlords dictate. __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

07-07-2008, 02:55 PM	#4
Radar Constitutional Scholar Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Ocala, FL Posts: 4,006	I've always known that private property is private property. For instance, the cellar belongs to UT. He alone can set standards for those who post on his board. Though this would normally severely limit the size of your online community. When I was running for congress a couple of years ago, I mentioned that I flag messages that violate the terms of use and someone got upset because they said, "Libertarians aren't against free speech". I had to explain to them that Craig Numark owns craigslist and he has the right to set standards for its use...which he has done. He has also given the community the ability to flag offensive messages. I told them, if they want free speech, they should open their own website, but even then, their provider could choose not to host certain kinds of websites. The only way for it to be truly free is for you to have your own fiber lines and switches going into the internet. Other than very large businesses and colleges, I don't know anyone who has something like that. __________________ "I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death." - George Carlin

07-07-2008, 04:39 PM	#6
lookout123 changed his status to single Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Right behind you. No, the other side. Posts: 10,308	It is fairly well documented Merc. Radar may have some ideas coming from far left field but he does get out and do something for those ideas. he isn't just hot air and bombastic declarations. __________________ Getting knocked down is no sin, it's not getting back up that's the sin

07-07-2008, 02:57 PM	#7
Radar Constitutional Scholar Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Ocala, FL Posts: 4,006	I've had arguments with people who refer to themselves as "owners" of groups on Yahoo. I have explained to them that they don't own anything and that Yahoo owns the servers, switches, and even the words left on those groups by people. __________________ "I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death." - George Carlin

07-07-2008, 08:47 AM	#3
SteveDallas Your Bartender Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Philly Burbs, PA Posts: 7,651	The problem is that hypothetical park is public land, maintained by the government at least partly with tax dollars for the benefit of the citizenry. Those Yahoo servers are owned, operated, and paid for by Yahoo. One of the most long-standing principles of The Internet is that you can generally do whatever you want on your own network. A recent example of this was a court case (in Texas?) where a spammer sued a university for blocking emails the spammer had sent to students. The court ruled that it was OK for the university to do that. I'm as much of a first amendment partisan as the next guy, but I wouldn't be thrilled if it suddenly became illegal for my employer to operate a spam blocker. (The role of actual ISPs as common carriers--or not--is admittedly somewhat murkier, but that's another discussion I don't have time to wade into right now.)

07-07-2008, 06:25 PM	#8
busterb NSABFD Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: MS. usa Posts: 3,908	Hate to say it, but true. __________________ I've haven't left very deep footprints in the sands of time. But, boy I've left a bunch.

07-12-2008, 06:16 PM	#9
deadbeater Sir Post-A-Lot Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 439	It could be worse; the US Defense Department could intervene and decree that only pro-military remarks are allowed to be posted, imaged, and disseminated. After all, they invented the Internet. Damn; had they done that, there would be no easy expansion of terrorism. But then there would be no free porn. Choices, choices. No porn or or allow porn, and terorrism. Last edited by deadbeater; 07-12-2008 at 06:35 PM.

07-12-2008, 06:46 PM	#10
SamIam Registered User Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Not here Posts: 2,655	I thought UT invented the Internet.

07-12-2008, 07:52 PM	#11
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	No, Al Gore invented it, UT is just the king. __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

07-14-2008, 07:43 PM	#13
richlevy King Of Wishful Thinking Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Philadelphia Suburbs Posts: 6,669	I remember being censored on Prodigy a long time ago. I asked on what grounds I was being censored, and an employee wrote that I could be censored for making negative comments about Prodigy or its advertisers. I canceled the service immediately. __________________ Exercise your rights and remember your obligations - VOTE! I have always believed that hope is that stubborn thing inside us that insists, despite all the evidence to the contrary, that something better awaits us so long as we have the courage to keep reaching, to keep working, to keep fighting. -- Barack Hussein Obama

07-14-2008, 08:15 PM	#14
Sundae polaroid of perfection Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 24,185	You were censored for being a firestarter, twisted firestarter?

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