Marriott's Response to Hotel Rape Suit

richlevy · 08-14-2009, 08:36 PM

Wow. From here

So, all of those security cameras and guards are just to make us feel good, like those fake security cameras you can buy to fool burglars? How do you 'mitigate your damage' in picking up your car? Personally, I think blaming a rape victim as part of a civil suit defense strategy is a losing proposition. And what is their point in interviewing friends and relatives of the victim. This isn't a date rape case where the victim's morals are at issue. The woman was raped by a transient in front of her kids. Do they really think they'll find some friend or relative who will state "yeah, she's always had this fantasy of being raped by an unwashed vagrant"?

Quote:

STAMFORD -- A downtown hotel being sued by a woman raped at gunpoint in its parking garage is claiming she was careless, negligent and "failed to exercise due care for her own safety and the safety of her children and proper use of her senses and facilities," according to court documents.
The victim's attorneys also argue the hotel has inadvertently identified her to acquaintances by asking them to testify.
The Stamford Marriott Hotel & Spa, along with the firms in charge of managing the hotel and its parking garage, made the claim as part of a list of special defenses filed in state Superior Court in Stamford last month. Such defenses allow defendants in civil suits to argue they are not responsible for damages even if the plaintiff's story is true.

Quote:

On Oct. 10, 2006, Fricker stuck a handgun in the back of the then 40-year-old woman and forced her and her children, then 3 and 5, into their minivan as they left the hotel, according to court documents.
She let him go through her wallet and told him he could take it, but Fricker demanded she take off her clothes. Fricker sexually assaulted the woman for several minutes, pointing the gun at her and her children and threatening to sexually assault one of her children.

Quote:

The hotel also claims as a special defense that the acts were unforeseen and beyond their control, that the woman and her children failed to properly "mitigate their damages," and that the hotel had not been notified about Fricker.

xoxoxoBruce · 08-15-2009, 01:01 AM

But don't you see she was leaving the hotel, which means they already had her money, so they don't give a rat's ass what happened to her after that.

Crimson Ghost · 08-15-2009, 02:24 AM

Project Mayhem is looking better all the time....

Sundae · 08-15-2009, 05:23 AM

Ummmm.
Not saying I back the hotel for their stance on this.

But sueing a hotel because you were raped?
What?
What if it was a park, or a street?
And who do I sue if I was raped in my own home? My parents?

Sorry, this might be normal in the US, in which case ignore me. It has me baffled.

Clodfobble · 08-15-2009, 08:42 AM

Think about it this way, SG: if she were inside the hotel, and a guy walked into her room and raped her, I think most people would say she had a case--the hotel is expected to have at least moderate security. If she's outside on the street, most people would say it's her problem. But because she was in the parking garage, it's unclear how responsible the hotel should have been for her safety.

This sort of thing usually settles out of court, however. Lord knows the hotel doesn't want the publicity of being the "rape hotel." I imagine the woman is refusing a settlement in the hopes of getting a bigger reward from the court.

Sundae · 08-15-2009, 09:18 AM

Thanks for the explanation, Clod. You always do it well.
But I still don't get it.
Hotels are private property, but in reality they're public places. No hotel I've ever known has stopped me walking in, or asked to see my key. Oh - I lie. They did in Siena (Italy). Everywhere else a purposeful walk has been enough to get me past Reception. And in the bigger hotels, Reception is miles away from the lifts anyway.

So, no. I would never expect a hotel to be responsible for my personal safety.
If a mad axeman ran rampant on my hotel floor I would not blame the hotel.
Doesn't mean it's my fault either - it's the fault of the psycho with the axe.

I don't want to stay in Colditz.
I don't want to have a screening before I can enter my hotel.
Therefore, I accept that bad things can happen.
I'm not belittling this woman's horrible experience. And I get that some people might not want to stay at that hotel because of it. But honestly - I just don't get how it's their fault.

If it was a member of hotel staff in her hotel room, maybe. That would raise the question of staff screening policies. But even then, bad people do bad things and bad people lie.
We're sposed to have a nannying culture here. Well, an Islamo-fascist state, to be more accurate. But this need to put the blame on someone, anyone, as long as they have money... It's just weird to me.

I hope she does get money.
Anyone who has been through this deserves counselling.
And I know from my experience it's one thing the NHS falls down on.
I'm just not sure it's the best way to go about things.

Cloud · 08-15-2009, 10:10 AM

Don't read too much into the legal language. These are technical legal defenses being raised in the pleadings, which is quite common, and completely expected by both sides. Such affirmative defenses must be plead, and any attorney who didn't would not be doing his/her job.

jinx · 08-15-2009, 10:38 AM

I'm with SG on this. I feel bad for the woman and her kids... but sometimes bad things just happen. Maybe she should sue god for allowing it.

xoxoxoBruce · 08-15-2009, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clodfobble

This sort of thing usually settles out of court, however. Lord knows the hotel doesn't want the publicity of being the "rape hotel." I imagine the woman is refusing a settlement in the hopes of getting a bigger reward from the court.

Or because of their attitude.

TheMercenary · 08-15-2009, 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jinx

I'm with SG on this. I feel bad for the woman and her kids... but sometimes bad things just happen. Maybe she should sue god for allowing it.

Or maybe she shouldn't wear short skirts.[/sarc]

jinx · 08-15-2009, 06:32 PM

Lay of the happy gas Merc, I didn't blame the woman, I just disagree with where she is placing blame.

Flint · 08-15-2009, 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jinx

Maybe she should sue god for allowing it.

Dear Moderators,

Can you please delete this comment before somone reads it and decides it sounds like a good idea? Thx --Flint

xoxoxoBruce · 08-15-2009, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jinx

I'm with SG on this. I feel bad for the woman and her kids... but sometimes bad things just happen. Maybe she should sue god for allowing it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flint

Dear Moderators,

Can you please delete this comment before somone reads it and decides it sounds like a good idea? Thx --Flint

Don't worry Flint...

Quote:

Replying to the question of how this man found himself at the State hosp.: "I really don't know. I just went to the police station to get a restraining order against God."

08-15-2009, 01:01 AM	#2
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	But don't you see she was leaving the hotel, which means they already had her money, so they don't give a rat's ass what happened to her after that. __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

08-15-2009, 02:24 AM	#3
Crimson Ghost Larger than life and twice as ugly. Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 5,264	Project Mayhem is looking better all the time.... __________________ We must all go through a rite of passage. It must be physical, it must be painful, and it must leave a mark. I have no knowledge of the events which you are describing, and if I did have knowledge of them, I would be unable to discuss them with you now or at any future period. Don't waste your time always searching for those wasted years

08-15-2009, 05:23 AM	#4
Sundae polaroid of perfection Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 24,185	Ummmm. Not saying I back the hotel for their stance on this. But sueing a hotel because you were raped? What? What if it was a park, or a street? And who do I sue if I was raped in my own home? My parents? Sorry, this might be normal in the US, in which case ignore me. It has me baffled. __________________ Life's hard you know, so strike a pose on a Cadillac

08-15-2009, 08:42 AM	#5
Clodfobble UNDER CONDITIONAL MITIGATION Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 20,012	Think about it this way, SG: if she were inside the hotel, and a guy walked into her room and raped her, I think most people would say she had a case--the hotel is expected to have at least moderate security. If she's outside on the street, most people would say it's her problem. But because she was in the parking garage, it's unclear how responsible the hotel should have been for her safety. This sort of thing usually settles out of court, however. Lord knows the hotel doesn't want the publicity of being the "rape hotel." I imagine the woman is refusing a settlement in the hopes of getting a bigger reward from the court. __________________ My book My other book My spirit animal

08-15-2009, 09:18 AM	#6
Sundae polaroid of perfection Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 24,185	Thanks for the explanation, Clod. You always do it well. But I still don't get it. Hotels are private property, but in reality they're public places. No hotel I've ever known has stopped me walking in, or asked to see my key. Oh - I lie. They did in Siena (Italy). Everywhere else a purposeful walk has been enough to get me past Reception. And in the bigger hotels, Reception is miles away from the lifts anyway. So, no. I would never expect a hotel to be responsible for my personal safety. If a mad axeman ran rampant on my hotel floor I would not blame the hotel. Doesn't mean it's my fault either - it's the fault of the psycho with the axe. I don't want to stay in Colditz. I don't want to have a screening before I can enter my hotel. Therefore, I accept that bad things can happen. I'm not belittling this woman's horrible experience. And I get that some people might not want to stay at that hotel because of it. But honestly - I just don't get how it's their fault. If it was a member of hotel staff in her hotel room, maybe. That would raise the question of staff screening policies. But even then, bad people do bad things and bad people lie. We're sposed to have a nannying culture here. Well, an Islamo-fascist state, to be more accurate. But this need to put the blame on someone, anyone, as long as they have money... It's just weird to me. I hope she does get money. Anyone who has been through this deserves counselling. And I know from my experience it's one thing the NHS falls down on. I'm just not sure it's the best way to go about things. __________________ Life's hard you know, so strike a pose on a Cadillac

08-15-2009, 10:10 AM	#7
Cloud ... Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 8,360	Don't read too much into the legal language. These are technical legal defenses being raised in the pleadings, which is quite common, and completely expected by both sides. Such affirmative defenses must be plead, and any attorney who didn't would not be doing his/her job. __________________ "Guard your honor. Let your reputation fall where it will. And outlive the bastards!"

08-15-2009, 10:38 AM	#8
jinx Come on, cat. Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: general vicinity of Philadelphia area Posts: 7,013	I'm with SG on this. I feel bad for the woman and her kids... but sometimes bad things just happen. Maybe she should sue god for allowing it. __________________ Crying won't help you, praying won't do you no good.

08-15-2009, 06:32 PM	#11
jinx Come on, cat. Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: general vicinity of Philadelphia area Posts: 7,013	Lay of the happy gas Merc, I didn't blame the woman, I just disagree with where she is placing blame. __________________ Crying won't help you, praying won't do you no good.

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