I love the Lebanese

[Undertoad]

Jacquelita doesn't like it when I post protest babes, she's jealous. So I'll just point to this gallery of images from Beirut and suggest you at least visit #38.

http://www.stavrotoons.com/Independa...asp?toonId=772

Glenn Reynolds points out... which side would you rather be on? The pro-Syria, pro-Hezbollah side looks like this:



The anti-Syria, pro-representational government looks like this:



CNN's Anderson Cooper is live in Beirut this week. His reports are so awesome.

These kids rock my world. They are in charge, and they know it. It's their Woodstock, their Burning Man, except that it's 100% political and their road to a better, freer life. And how do they show it? With beautiful optimism and celebration. They have DRUM CIRCLES, they play flutes, they sing joyously. They love the West and want to be more like it.

[chainsaw]

I work with two men from Lebanon. They are very jolly happy souls. I enjoy working with them.

[jaguar]

Lebanon is already pretty western. Some interesting stuff turned up about the car-bomb this week, looks like a well pre-planned operation by Syrian or possibly Lebanese intel guys, they think it was 600(!!!)kg of explosives. They've only got one car for testing because the others were cleared away suspiciously fast - the reason the have the one is because it was blown clear over a building into the sea. They really weren't taking any chances. There was an interesting photo leaked to the press of the bomb site a couple of days before with a big manhole cover and a sus-as-hell looking black box next to it, can't find it now though.

If Syria does withdraw there is a real danger of a power vacuum, maybe this time it'll end nicely but lots of people I've spoken to who know about this stuff feel that there will be more violence before it's settled - but Mr Lebanon's sons have fled to avoid assassination already.

[mrnoodle]

any official number on the protest? I know the pro-Lebanese one beat the Hezbollah (sp) one by at least 500k, but I've heard rumors that there could have been as many as 3 or 4 million people there.

Let's see. 400,000 people at the pro-Syria rally, all of whom were either bussed in or threatened with their lives, vs. 3 million who came out of their own accord to support freedom. I like this trend.

[jaguar]

all of whom were either bussed in or threatened with their lives

Interesting assumption. Extra points for myopia. Hizbollah enjoys a lot of support, it runs schools, hospitals and media and holds seats in parliament. It's very popular in the Shia community, which is about 40% of Lebanon.

[BigV]

Originally Posted by jaguar

Interesting assumption. Extra points for myopia. Hizbollah enjoys a lot of support, it runs schools, hospitals and media and holds seats in parliament. It's very popular in the Shia community, which is about 40% of Lebanon.

I also heard (one statement) on a BBC report that the pro-Syrian protestors were paid, and implied that the anti-Syrian protestors were not. Draw your own conclusions about which movitation is more noble.

[mrnoodle]

Originally Posted by jaguar

Hizbollah enjoys a lot of support, it runs schools, hospitals and media and holds seats in parliament. It's very popular in the Shia community, which is about 40% of Lebanon.

It also ran a series of kidnappings of Westerners in Lebanon, including several Americans, in the 1980s; the suicide truck bombings that killed more than 200 U.S. Marines at their barracks in Beirut, Lebanon, in 1983; the 1985 hijacking of TWA flight 847, which featured the famous footage of the plane’s pilot leaning out of the cockpit with a gun to his head; and two major 1990s attacks on Jewish targets in Argentina—the 1992 bombing of the Israeli Embassy (killing 29) and the 1994 bombing of a Jewish community center (killing 95).


Hassan Nasrallah, their terrorist in chief, said "Death to America is not a slogan. Death to America is a policy, a strategy and a vision."

You'll just have to pardon me if my view of this organization tends toward the negative.

[jaguar]

Um, most of what hizbollah does/has done has had broad-base popular suport, particularly forcing Israel to retreat. You may have a negative view of the organisation but you cannot deny it has popular support in lebanon particularly with the Shia. End of story. Hizbollah has long been patronised by Syria and I'm sure pressure was applied on hizbollah to get people out but to assume they were [ b]all[/b] threatened and bribed is frankly, sillyness on a iamthewalrus kind of level. It's generalizations like that that cause so much troulbe in the first place. BigV, i'm sure some were, an yes, if anyone has the moral high ground it's the people that want syria out but all I said is hizbollah had popular support, that's all. I never said I liked hizbollah or that hizbollah were right or anything else.

[mrnoodle]

i admit to the blanket generalization. And it does have quite broad support in the Shi'ite community. But Shia are no longer defined by their religious views (I think they're the ones that believe only descendants of Mohammed should rule Islamic ppl), but by their jihad against Isreal and the west.

watch the so-called "popularity" of Hizbollah disintegrate after the Lebanese realize that Syria will no longer be calling the shots in their country. It's obviously a guess, but I'd bet that half of the people in the pro-Syria rally were there under pressure of some kind. No way to prove it either way.

[jaguar]

watch the so-called "popularity" of Hizbollah disintegrate after the Lebanese realise that Syria will no longer be calling the shots in their country.

Doubt it. Hizbollah is very deeply rooted in Shia culture in Lebanon, while you might like to see it as an evil terrorist network propped up by Syria it's something much larger, broader and far more pervasive. Hizbollah controls swaths of Lebanon. One of many reasons the leaving of Syrian troops might not be the panacea a lot of people image it is.

[richlevy]

Basically, Syria's ties with Hezbollah resemble our ties with the Contras in the 1980's. Easily deniable and able to sever at a moments notice. Hezbollah probably has enough other avenues of support to exist without Syria's support.

[jaguar]

Hizbollah certainly can continue to exist without them but the links are a lot less hidden than that.

[Undertoad]

One of my favorite bloggers Michael Totten has <a href=http://www.michaeltotten.com/archives/000768.html>more news photos showing the differences between the two protests</a>.

[lumberjim]

i prefer the lesbianese

[BigV]

Originally Posted by lumberjim

i prefer the lesbianese

Now that's funny!