The Obamanation

[Clodfobble]

Is it possible that part of the rise in college costs is the fact that everyone is expected to go to college now, even when they are not really suited for it, or they are getting a completely useless degree?

[DanaC]

Originally Posted by Clodfobble

Is it possible that part of the rise in college costs is the fact that everyone is expected to go to college now, even when they are not really suited for it, or they are getting a completely useless degree?

Wss ^


I find this really interesting. This is a real problem in the Uk now. Not in terms of rising college costs, though they are a factor for a different set of reasons, but but in terms of forcing large swathes of youngsters down a university route who could once have entered the field as apprentices or trainees with only college level (pre-bachelors), or school leaver level qualifications.

The last government had the brilliant idea of trying to tackle social inequality by channelling more people into university. Great. Sounds a good idea, in theory, that increasing educational opportunity for the lower economic communities in particular might assist in tackling generational poverty and lack of expectations. But then they got silly about it. They made their target that 50% of young adults would go to university. Fifty fucking per cent.

All the polytechnics became new universities, and all the colleges started investigating degree confirment relationships with universities, to increase access for hard to reach communities. Loads of new degree courses sprang up. Degrees in things that were once taught through doing the job alongside experienced colleagues.

A-level courses (pre-degree) began to reflect the new degree options, as pathways to those degrees were needed. Kids taking so-called 'soft' courses at this level would find when they came to university applications, that they were disadvantaged for all but the technical, or career specific degrees that those a-levels were designed to fill. Last couple of years universities have started being a bit more vocal about schools making pupils aware of this when they come to choose their subject paths.

The rush for everybody to go to university, meant a corresponding rush for everybody to get the right pre-degree qualifications, which upped the entry level expectations for starter level jobs generally.

Getting a-levels at the age of 17/18 used to mean something in the workplace. Many lower management or supervisory jobs required a couple of a-levels and a couple of years in-house experience. Goodluck getting anything like that now without having a bachelors degree under your belt.

And not just a bachelors either. With so many people getting degrees there are way more first class degrees around now. A Second Class degree used to be a respectable achievement. Even a 2:2 set you apart from the mainstream. Now a 1st class degree is pretty much expected for entry into a lot of professional fields.

The pressure on young people to follow an academic, or pseudo-academic route is tremendous. The current massive hike in fees may well stall that.

[Lamplighter]

I believe there were four critical factors that pushed the US down that road:
"Sputnik"and "Civil Rights" and "Viet Nam" and "Cancer"

Before the 60's and after WW II, the G.I. Bill made college accessible for all veterans.
With very exceptions this remains true even now.

Sputnik put an enormous amount of government $ into college and university systems
Not just for engineers, but for all the sciences and general education.

Before Civil Rights, the US had a long history of educational segregation.
The HBCU's were the only institutions available for most
black students.... all the most so for poor, black students.
Opening all colleges and universities set off the ugly debates
about "quotas" and "reverse discrimination" and "un-qualified"
students that continues to this day.

Viet Nam deferments and percent of non-whites "in country" were matters of life and death.

Cancer, like sputnik, changed the entire structure of government-funded research,
primarily in medical sciences (NIH), but for most other granting agencies and foundations.

The sum of these four is that the better (non-MacD) jobs now require paper credentials.
Unfortunately, the 4-yr and graduate degree have less meaning as evidence of learning.
They are the union-card necessary (but not sufficient) to get past the employer's receptionist.