Police don't have to knock, CNN article

[DanaC]

I'm going to the UK for a few days in July, and I'll be completely disarmed the entire time

Unless you look like an Arab or a Pakistani you'll be fine. Very few guns over here compared to over there and very few gun deaths.

If we look at America's record over the years, we could probably find many more incidents of people being shot by police unnecessarily than over here. You'll be fine:P

[MaggieL]

Originally Posted by DanaC

Unless you look like an Arab or a Pakistani you'll be fine. Very few guns over here compared to over there and very few gun deaths.

Yes, the thugs don't need guns, apparently they're getting by with knives.

It's not your cops I'm thinking of. And just to put a button on it all, I'll be there on 7/7.

[MaggieL]

Originally Posted by DanaC

If we look at America's record over the years, we could probably find many more incidents of people being shot by police unnecessarily than over here.

Probably so...considering your cops haven't been allowed to have guns for very long and the population of the UK is about 60 million vs. 260 million here.

[DanaC]

Maggie, the man survived.

Unfortunately, the young man they shot on the underground (Brazilian, darkish skinned, mistaken identity) died. They also lied about him too.

2005 http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4713753.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4711021.stm

2006 http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/5077198.stm

Unfortunately our police have developed what appears to be a habit of releasing immediate statements which turn out to be untrue, followed by a revised statement a day or so later and then a few days after that we get the truth.

Initially after the Brazilian lad was shot, they claimed they had shouted at him to stop and he ran into the station, jumped over the barrier and onto the train.
It was later revealed, by eyewitnesses that no warning had been shouted and the lad in fact had been running for a train....nor did he jump over the barrier.

The police ran onto the stationary train ....then two of them dragged him to the floor and the third pumped 7 bullets into him at point blank range.

Turns out, he had come out of the block of flats they'd been watching.....unfortunately, one of the poeple watching the flats had nipped off for a quick piss and wasn't sure if he had come from the right flat, but hey, he had dark skin and that made him suspicious.

Later when they published pictures of him, they showed a picture which made him look quite pale. That same picture was later shown to be of a much darker hue. The suggestion is that they altered the picture to off set the accusations of racism.

[DanaC]

But I'll stop hi-jacking this thread now :P

So, how bout that? No need to knock!

[DanaC]

population of the UK is about 60 million vs. 260 million here.

:P

[DanaC]

Seriously, Maggie. You'll have a nice time here. The crime rate isn't as high as it sounds in th news. We have very few knife attacks as well. Mostly that sort of thing affects very localised 'hotspots' and usually involves young lads and lasses in difficult areas.

For the most part it's a very safe country.

*smiles*

Bit like...If I were to holiday in America...I would imagine I'd be fine if I went to Ohio, but not necessarily if I went to South Central:P Liekwise, if you go to most places in the UK you'll be fine. Just be careful if you are planning a holiday on a run down Council estate in Hackney:P

[MaggieL]

I'm not seriously worried...I just resent being disarmed involuntarily, even for a few days. I won't go to New Jersey for exactly that reason. Or South Central. ;-)

http://www.reason.com/0211/fe.jm.gun.shtml

[Kitsune]

Originally Posted by MaggieL

I'm not seriously worried...I just resent being disarmed involuntarily, even for a few days. I won't go to New Jersey for exactly that reason. Or South Central. ;-)

Just out of curiosity -- did something happen to you to make you fear being out in public this much without a weapon or are the areas where you go really that bad?

[MaggieL]

Originally Posted by Kitsune

Just out of curiosity -- did something happen to you to make you fear being out in public this much without a weapon or are the areas where you go really that bad?

I do live near some bad areas. But let's not confuse "being fearful" with wishing to assert my right to self-defense, and resenting interference with that right. Did you visit the Pink Pistols site?

The State has no legitimate interest in disarming me, yet too many small-s states (and some smaller jursidictions like Philadelphia and San Francisco) still want to do exactly that. I see no reason to go through the additional hassle to secure my weapon in order to travel to a place where the government doesn't trust me with it. (I'm making a special limited exception for the UK for a few days because that's where my daughter wants to get married.)

Not trusting citizens to be armed is a remarkable touchstone for other crappy attitudes on the part of government.

[Griff]

Originally Posted by MaggieL

I do live near some bad areas. But let's not confuse "being fearful" with wishing to assert my right to self-defense, and resenting interference with that right.

...

Not trusting citizens to be armed is a remarkable touchstone for other crappy attitudes on the part of government.

My sentiments as well. I don't carry, but I do own firearms. There is great value in the State's administrators knowing that the people still retain the capacity to use force. A State monopoly on such is not how people stay free.

[Kitsune]

Originally Posted by MaggieL

I do live near some bad areas. But let's not confuse "being fearful" with wishing to assert my right to self-defense, and resenting interference with that right. Did you visit the Pink Pistols site?

That's cool. I'm just interested in people's reasons for carrying even though, in truth, you don't have to have one at all to do so.

Funny, that: I used to carry because I traversed some bad neighborhoods, but it was the fear of local law enforcement that caused me to stop packing.

[DanaC]

Personally I would feel in more danger if I had a gun in my bag than without :P Statistics have shown that when someone pulls a gun in a conflict, they are actually most likely to be the one that gets shot with it ( this carries through on knives as well).

[Ibby]

When it comes to gun control, I feel protected enough that everyone else has one. The bad guys don't know that I dont. Even if I did, I wouldnt use it.

EDIT: unless my girlfriend is threatened. There'll be holy hell to pay for anyone who threatens her. But thats a different matter. Kinda.

[Elspode]

Gents...ladies...you're just worrying too much. If you aren't doing anything wrong, you have nothing to fear. Just a few bucks to repair your door and patch the holes they tear into your walls, and perhaps some medical bills if you get shot in the chest...that's all.

Remember, by giving up your constitutional rights a little bit at a time, it is much less painful than having the Ultraconservative Fascists take over in a nasty coup. Plus, you'll be ever so much safer with each right that you give up. Remember...its for the children.