South Africa's high court approves gay marriage - Page 2

DanaC · 11-18-2006, 05:59 PM

Yeah. Fairness isn't the least important.

9th Engineer · 11-20-2006, 05:36 PM

Nice to see shawnee chomping at the bit there, at least I'm not being ignored. The first thing I'd address is that the effect doesn't have to be really damaging for me to be involved in it. If it doesn't hurt me then I won't say nay, but all it has to do is impact me in some way for me to want a say in it. The most obvious way it impacts me is the very things people say they want, you're now introducing a large new group of people entering systems they've never been a part of. That will impact me through new obligations (I've actually already had to attend seminars on gay/trans workplace dymanics), increases in fees to cover new obligations of companees, and in other obvious ways. This isn't really what most people talk about of course when they say it will impact them, and frankly it isn't the majority of what I care about. But I needed to make an interm post here while frantically throwing all my stuff into duffle bags for my trip home (Thanksgiving break), lest shawnee's sentiments snowball and ruin any chance at an honest response.

Spexxvet · 11-20-2006, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 9th Engineer

...increases in fees to cover new obligations of companees, ...

Typical conservative.... it always comes back to the dollars.

Aliantha · 11-20-2006, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 9th Engineer

The first thing I'd address is that the effect doesn't have to be really damaging for me to be involved in it. If it doesn't hurt me then I won't say nay, but all it has to do is impact me in some way for me to want a say in it. The most obvious way it impacts me is the very things people say they want, you're now introducing a large new group of people entering systems they've never been a part of. That will impact me through new obligations (I've actually already had to attend seminars on gay/trans workplace dymanics), increases in fees to cover new obligations of companees, and in other obvious ways. This isn't really what most people talk about of course when they say it will impact them, and frankly it isn't the majority of what I care about.

Must have been tough seeing the whiteboard at that seminar with the blinders on...

Shawnee123 · 11-21-2006, 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 9th Engineer

Nice to see shawnee chomping at the bit

Darling baby, if I were chomping at your bit you would know it.

In the meantime, get back with me when you've been at least halfway around the block.

Also, why is it always ME you retort to...with all the gaff you've received over your posts the only one you have the balls to call out is me. Do you find me harmless? Do you think me weak? You have another think coming.

Flint · 11-18-2006, 07:20 PM

Fuck fairness.

We're America, we don't have to be fair, because God is on our side.
(Repeat, but substitute Jewish, Islamic dieties, then have all kill each other.)

Ibby · 11-18-2006, 08:07 PM

Being treated fairly and equally, not being discriminated against, IS a human right, and it is completely unacceptable to deny anything to someone based on their sex.

9th Engineer · 11-18-2006, 08:28 PM

Fuck fairness is exactly the mindset of America today, it frustrates me to no end. However, gay marriage is not the most pressing issue in this catagory. We have problems with education, health care, taxes, social security, immigration, the list goes on and on. The ultimate in fairness is ideal libertarianism, but there is a big enough bleeding heart population here to rule that out. Fairness is letting the crack addict freeze to death on the street. Fairness is taking kids away from incompetent parents so they have a decent shot at life. Fairness is mother taking a screaming kid around to all the tables in the restaurant to apologise and humble themselves on threat of spanking. Fairness is tough and heartless, and frankly most people don't have the guts to be fair. Fair means equal exchange in all cases, no inherent rights, tough titty for you if you f*ck things up.

Flint · 11-18-2006, 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 9th Engineer

...gay marriage is not the most pressing issue in this catagory...

It is: because a certain political party is making it a pressing issue. Can you guess which one?

9th Engineer · 11-18-2006, 08:52 PM

Both are, leftists are pressing for the laws to be passed and rightists are pushing back with equal pressure.

Spexxvet · 11-20-2006, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 9th Engineer

Both are, leftists are pressing for the laws to be passed and rightists are pushing back with equal pressure.

Conservative politicians are. Gay citizens are. Liberal politicans are not.

Ibby · 11-18-2006, 09:39 PM

No, rightwing nutjobs are trying to get it BANNED, and leftwing commies, with the exception of a few activists, are doing jack shit.

11-18-2006, 09:47 PM

I don't see how its not being "the most important issue" is relavant... that is really confusing to me.
We can do only one thing at at time?
It is a human/civil rights issue.
Partners not being able to share in the suffering at a hospital, deal with taxes together, be a family legally, share in all aspects that all other families do because others (who have no business sticking their noses into their lives) want to have a say, say so... is definitely a violation of their civil rights.

9th Engineer · 11-19-2006, 01:16 AM

Don't bring the tired argument of "you can't stick your nose into my life", if what you do affects me, I have every right to get involved in your buisness. Does this affect me, absolutely. I can make the choice of whether I agree with the changes or not, but don't delude yourself that anything people do has no effect on others.

bluecuracao · 11-19-2006, 01:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 9th Engineer

Does this affect me, absolutely.

How does it affect you?

11-20-2006, 05:36 PM	#2
9th Engineer Bioengineer and aspiring lawer Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 872	Nice to see shawnee chomping at the bit there, at least I'm not being ignored. The first thing I'd address is that the effect doesn't have to be really damaging for me to be involved in it. If it doesn't hurt me then I won't say nay, but all it has to do is impact me in some way for me to want a say in it. The most obvious way it impacts me is the very things people say they want, you're now introducing a large new group of people entering systems they've never been a part of. That will impact me through new obligations (I've actually already had to attend seminars on gay/trans workplace dymanics), increases in fees to cover new obligations of companees, and in other obvious ways. This isn't really what most people talk about of course when they say it will impact them, and frankly it isn't the majority of what I care about. But I needed to make an interm post here while frantically throwing all my stuff into duffle bags for my trip home (Thanksgiving break), lest shawnee's sentiments snowball and ruin any chance at an honest response. __________________ The most valuable renewable resource is stupidity.

11-18-2006, 07:20 PM	#6
Flint Snowflake Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Dystopia Posts: 13,136	Fuck fairness. We're America, we don't have to be fair, because God is on our side. (Repeat, but substitute Jewish, Islamic dieties, then have all kill each other.) __________________ **************** There's a level of facility that everyone needs to accomplish, and from there it's a matter of deciding for yourself how important ultra-facility is to your expression. ... I found, like Joseph Campbell said, if you just follow whatever gives you a little joy or excitement or awe, then you're on the right track. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Terry Bozzio**

11-18-2006, 08:07 PM	#7
Ibby erika Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: "the high up north" Posts: 6,127	Being treated fairly and equally, not being discriminated against, IS a human right, and it is completely unacceptable to deny anything to someone based on their sex. __________________ not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh

11-18-2006, 08:28 PM	#8
9th Engineer Bioengineer and aspiring lawer Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 872	Fuck fairness is exactly the mindset of America today, it frustrates me to no end. However, gay marriage is not the most pressing issue in this catagory. We have problems with education, health care, taxes, social security, immigration, the list goes on and on. The ultimate in fairness is ideal libertarianism, but there is a big enough bleeding heart population here to rule that out. Fairness is letting the crack addict freeze to death on the street. Fairness is taking kids away from incompetent parents so they have a decent shot at life. Fairness is mother taking a screaming kid around to all the tables in the restaurant to apologise and humble themselves on threat of spanking. Fairness is tough and heartless, and frankly most people don't have the guts to be fair. Fair means equal exchange in all cases, no inherent rights, tough titty for you if you f*ck things up. __________________ The most valuable renewable resource is stupidity.

11-18-2006, 08:52 PM	#10
9th Engineer Bioengineer and aspiring lawer Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 872	Both are, leftists are pressing for the laws to be passed and rightists are pushing back with equal pressure. __________________ The most valuable renewable resource is stupidity.

11-18-2006, 05:59 PM	#1
DanaC We have to go back, Kate! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 25,964	Yeah. Fairness isn't the least important.

11-18-2006, 09:39 PM	#12
Ibby erika Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: "the high up north" Posts: 6,127	No, rightwing nutjobs are trying to get it BANNED, and leftwing commies, with the exception of a few activists, are doing jack shit. __________________ not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh

11-18-2006, 09:47 PM	#13
rkzenrage Guest Posts: n/a	I don't see how its not being "the most important issue" is relavant... that is really confusing to me. We can do only one thing at at time? It is a human/civil rights issue. Partners not being able to share in the suffering at a hospital, deal with taxes together, be a family legally, share in all aspects that all other families do because others (who have no business sticking their noses into their lives) want to have a say, say so... is definitely a violation of their civil rights. Last edited by rkzenrage; 11-18-2006 at 09:50 PM.

11-19-2006, 01:16 AM	#14
9th Engineer Bioengineer and aspiring lawer Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 872	Don't bring the tired argument of "you can't stick your nose into my life", if what you do affects me, I have every right to get involved in your buisness. Does this affect me, absolutely. I can make the choice of whether I agree with the changes or not, but don't delude yourself that anything people do has no effect on others. __________________ The most valuable renewable resource is stupidity.

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