Government Shut Down

[Perry Winkle]

I seriously doubt the president ordered the barricades specifically. It's probably SOP when the Parks service closes certain things indefinitely.

Originally Posted by glatt

I'd be curious to know the arrangement for Franklin Square park. It's really just a one block city park with meandering foot paths and an occasional dirt shortcut. But it's technically part of the National Park system, and it hasn't been barricaded. No bathrooms, but somebody has been emptying the trash cans. Maybe it's a private trash company and the account has been paid in advance for the next month or something.

I have this fantasy that if the trash started overflowing and there was no pickup service in sight then the community would step up and clean up. I know that's not likely.

[infinite monkey]

I thought about that too, Perry. Then I thought of all the people who leave used tissues in the shopping carts and don't push the carts together in the cart corrals. It's always someone else's job. (this is a known pet peeve of mine...you can fit 8 carts in the corral if you just push them in there, and even less when the more likely action is to shove them in there and let them go all sideways. I estimate you can fit 20 or 30 carts in there when they're all mated up and even like they should be. I think these folks think they are doing the good societal thing. NOT helpful, folks. Whew. Glad I got that off my chest. )

Is Adak seriously saying that President Obama ordered the barricades, and did so to SPITE?
Good lawd in heaven. I think he thinks that posting such rot here, it will get picked up by folks who are googling and therefore his agenda will get to more of the masses. Maybe he's on Faux News' payroll?

[glatt]

It's very interesting to me how this veterans turned away at the WW2 memorial site has resounded with Republicans. It's not just Adak, it's all over Facebook too.

At first I was like WTF? This is trivial. But then it struck me. Republicans (and conservatives) are all about symbolism. This is a perfect confluence of symbols. You have the veterans. You have a memorial, which is just some bricks and stones and fountains and stuff, but is the ultimate symbol, and you have the jackbooted thugs trying to stop the brave vets from paying their respects. It's a perfect confluence of symbolism for conservatives.

You might think that they would be upset over new cancer patients not getting into NIH studies, or social security payments being put in jeopardy in a couple weeks, or any of the thousands of other concrete things. But it's the symbolic stuff that speaks to them.

A handful of people were disappointed when their plans got messed up, so they made a fuss and got their plans straightened out. It's a non story. But the symbolism, man. The symbolism!

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by glatt

It's very interesting to me how this veterans turned away at the WW2 memorial site has resounded with Republicans.

I wonder why this large group of WW II vets happen to pick that day to visit?
Smells like teaparty to me.

[Lamplighter]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

I wonder why this large group of WW II vets happen to pick that day to visit?
Smells like teaparty to me.

I don't think it's (all) due to the TeaParty... My wife has been taking
physical therapy for knee surgery, and several weeks ago she told me
that a elderly man in her PT group had been offered an "honor flight" to
DC (i.e., $ free) to visit the Memorial.

Besides, the TP'ers don't strike me as being that public spirited.
I think they are just taking advantage of a coincidental situation.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Looks like you're right, they're just opportunists, using the vets.

Numerous members of Congress were on hand Wednesday, ushering in dozens of veterans visiting the nation's capital through Honor Flights from Illinois and Missouri.

"We talked as members about making sure there were enough of us down here so we could get them in," said Rep. Michele Bachmann, R-Minn.

The National Park Service tweeted that the veterans would be able to see the monument that honors them. "The Honor Flights are being granted access to the WWII Memorial to conduct 1st Amendment actives in accordance with NPS regulations — Carol B Johnson (@NationalMallPIO) October 2, 2013"

Almost daily the Honor Flight Network brings groups of World War II veterans to the memorial.

[Adak]

Originally Posted by glatt

You might think that they would be upset over new cancer patients not getting into NIH studies, or social security payments being put in jeopardy in a couple weeks, or any of the thousands of other concrete things. But it's the symbolic stuff that speaks to them.

I'M SO GLAD you brought up the problem of new cancer patients getting into NIH studies.

It's their last hope - a new drug trial, when standard drugs have failed.

So Harry Reid was asked this VERY question about it by CNN's reporter. Here's what the bastard had to say:

Read this through and you'll understand EXACTLY why I hate the idea of the Feds running our health care, etc.

Because so many are like this Democratic leader:

From CNN and Canada Free Press:
http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/58331

Yesterday, during a press conference, CNN’s Dana Bash had a simple question for Harry Reid. Republicans in the House were promising to pass a CR funding the National Institutes of Health - thus allowing NIH research into childhood cancer to continue despite the shutdown - and Bash wanted to know if Reid and his cronies would allow it to pass the Senate.

After all, it would take a cruel, hubristic, thug to deny funding that could potentially save the life of an 8-year-old with leukemia, right?

“You all talked about children with cancer unable to go to clinical trials,” Bash pointed out. “The House is presumably going to pass a bill funds at least the NIH. Given what you’ve said, will you at least pass that? And if not, aren’t you playing the same political games that Republicans are?

Reid was indignant.

“Listen,” he barked. “Sen. Durbin explained that very well. And he did it here. He did it on the floor earlier - as did Sen. Schumer. What right did they have to pick and choose what part of government is going to be funded? It’s obvious what’s going on here. You talk about reckless and irresponsible. Wow! What this is all about is Obamacare. They are obsessed. I don’t know what other word I can use. I don’t know what other word I can use. They are obsessed with this Obamacare. It’s working. It’s working now and it will continue to work and people will love it more than they do now by far. “

“But,” Bash countered “If you can help one child who has cancer, why wouldn’t you do it?”

At this point, Reid still had a chance. There was still the possibility that he could turn it around, and not make himself look like the unfeeling big-government vermin we all know him to be. Reid failed to save his bacon.

“Why would we want to do that?” Reid said angrily. “I have 1,100 people at Nellis Air Force base that are sitting home. They have a few problems of their own. To have someone of your intelligence suggest such a thing maybe means you’re irresponsible and reckless.”

Here, we finally have some truth from the left. To a man like Harry Reid, who sees the world only in terms of political gamesmanship, kids are either pawns or burdens. Why would he want to save one child? Children can’t vote, they don’t donate to campaigns, and they have no power in the national news media.

Remember earlier this year when an 11-year-old Pennsylvania girl needed a lung transplant? Dems like HHS director Kathleen Sebilius said, hey “Some people live. Some people die.” In her mind, rules and politics trumped children. That’s what Sebilius believed then, and it’s what Harry Reid thinks today.

The fact that Reid is advancing an equivocation between children fighting cancer and non-essential civilian Air Force personnel being forced to take a few days off is stunning in its inhumanity.

So, to answer Harry’s point: YES. Conservatives are furious about Obamacare. Why would anyone want a gang of heartless bureaucrats involved with their health care, when they have such a monstrous track record?

And that's why I don't like Obamacare, or any gov't intrusion into any more area's of our lives.

We have them in too much of it, already.

[Lamplighter]

I agree that Reid "lost it" in this exchange, and it will be quoted again and again by the GOP.
But..., and there is a always a "but" with these kinds of "gotcha" scenes.

Just as the Reid lost this bout, the GOP face is losing in the long run because
that "just one child" was already waiting there in line all along ... well before
the GOP forced this shut down.

The GOP knew - or should have known - that NIH research would be affected,
and children would be dying because of their rigidity that caused the shut down.

It makes for juicy TV for both sides, but "just one child" is being overwhelmed
in public opinion by what caused it:

Rep. Marlin Stutzman, R-Ind.:

“We’re not going to be disrespected.
We have to get something out of this.
And I don’t know what that even is.”

[Adak]

No one would have predicted that the NIH would have been shut down, AND that the Senate would not approve (or possibly even vote on), a resolution from the House, to keep it working.

Marlin Stutzman sounds like he's been asleep for the last 5 days or so.

Another shut down victim:

Mt. Vernon museum - yes, George Washington's Home. The feds don't own it, so they couldn't shut it down - but they do own the land that the Mr. Vernon parking lot uses.

So they erected their Barrycades. The museum is still open, but you can't park your car as is normal.

It's all about making us uncomfortable. We the People don't own the parking lot - the gov't owns the parking lot, and they'll decide we We the People, can use it.

[Datalyss]

Originally Posted by Big Sarge

Do you think there will be a government shut down? I'm very worried. All of my income is based upon the Feds. Currently, I draw:

VA Disability
Post 9/11 GI Bill
Nation Guard pay while awaiting my med board

I'm worried. I don't want to go back to being homeless

I don't know if all 'at falls under social securiy benefits, but if so, your checks should arrive on time. My RSDI check was auto-deposited into my bank account today.

[Clodfobble]

My dad was complaining about telemarketers calling his new home phone number.

"No problem," says I, "give me a second and I'll put the new number on the Do Not Call list."

Er... nevermind.

National Do Not Call Registry

Due to the Government shutdown, we are unable to offer this website service at this time. We will resume normal operations when the government is funded.

Debido al cierre del gobierno no podemos ofrecer este servicio telefónico en este momento. Nosotros reanudaremos el funcionamiento normal cuando el gobierno este fianciado.

[Lamplighter]

Originally Posted by Clodfobble

My dad was complaining about telemarketers calling his new home phone number.

"No problem," says I, "give me a second and I'll put the new number on the Do Not Call list."

Er... nevermind.

Some people like to say that government can't do anything right.
But the "Do Not Call" Registry is one of the most successful laws ever passed.
Our dinner-times are so much more peaceful now.

[sexobon]

Through early morning fog I see
Through never ending debates I see
Visions of the things to be
Visions of lost security
The pains that are withheld for me
The culture running away from me
I realize and I can see...
I realize and I can see...

That suicide is painless
That govm't shutdown is painless
It brings on many changes
It brings on many changes
And I can take or leave it if I please
And I can take or leave it if I please

I try to find a way to make
I try to find a way to make
All our little joys relate
All our political views relate
Without that ever-present hate
Without that ever-present hate
But now I know that it's too late, and...
But now I know that it's too late, and...

Suicide is painless
Govm't shutdown is painless
It brings on many changes
It brings on many changes
And I can take or leave it if I please
And I can take or leave it if I please

The game of life is hard to play
The game of politics isn't hard to play
I'm gonna lose it anyway
We're gonna nay it anyway
The losing card I'll someday lay
The loser's price I'll someday pay
So this is all I have to say
So this is all I have to say

That suicide is painless
That govm't shutdown is painless
It brings on many changes
It brings on many changes
And I can take or leave it if I please
And I can take or leave it if I please

The only way to win is cheat
The only way to win is cheat
And lay it down before I'm beat
And vote it down into defeat
And to another give my seat
And on another put some heat
For that's the only painless feat
For that's the only priceless feat

And suicide is painless
And govm't shutdown is painless
It brings on many changes
It brings on many changes
And I can take or leave it if I please
And I can take or leave it if I please

The sword of time will pierce our skins
The budget cuts will pierce our skins
It doesn't hurt when it begins
It doesn't hurt when they begin
But as it works its way on in
But as they work their way on in
The pain grows stronger...watch it grin, but...
The pain grows stronger...watch them grin, but...

Suicide is painless
Govm't shutdown is painless
It brings on many changes
It brings on many changes
And I can take or leave it if I please
And I can take or leave it if I please

A brave man once requested me
A President once requested me
To answer questions that are key
To gather votes that are key
'Is it to be or not to be'
To pass through Congress by majority
And I replied 'Oh why ask me?'
And I replied 'Oh that's not me?'

'Cause suicide is painless
'Cause govm't shutdown is painless
It brings on many changes
It brings on many changes
And I can take or leave it if I please
And I can take or leave it if I please
...and you can do the same thing if you choose
...and you can do the same thing if you're a fool

[Adak]

The timing of the next election for Representatives, is critical. The Republicans that were elected in 2012, will be up for re-election next year, and they BETTER be able to show their districts/precincts that they have taken conservative actions during their term.

Or they won't have another one.

I'd like to believe that Obamacare can be fixed, and put back into the national health care plan I noted, in my last post. I'm afraid however, that it will wind up with an arcane set of regulations, rivaling that of the IRS - with umpteen winners and losers, and tiers in between, all wrapped up in a Gordian Knot.

The shut down is just the answer to the question "What can a conservative do, to slow down the fast-running liberal train, in American politics?

Right now, that "thing you can do" is to help slow or stop Obamacare, and maybe through negotiations, win some other concessions. Maybe a cut in actual spending NOW, maybe the keystone pipeline, but throw them a bone, a win of some kind, here.

Not Obamacare, of course, but SOMETHING tangible.

Because nothing else the conservatives have done in the past 2 years, has amounted to a hill of beans. The conservatives know it. The conservative Representatives know that their voters know it, and neither their voters at home, nor the Reps in Congress, are happy about it.

For his part, Boehner knows he has been way too quiet, and way too compromising, for way too long. If he kept it up, he'd have been replaced (again!) as the Republican leader in the House.

So the Democrat egged on enough Republicans to get something racist, something anti-gay, something goofy or dumb, and he has it published as "REAL".

Why am I not surprised? I can do the same leading questions to a bunch of Democrats, and wind up with the same stupid replies, to justify my position that Democrats are racists, intellectually dishonest, and baby-killers.

Proving absolutely nothing. No consensus has been reached, no negotiations have made progress. It's just name calling, the other side.

Sure, that's what we need right now - more name calling - that writer must be a political genius!

[Adak]

The longer the shut down, the more closely the repercussions of it will remain as part of Obama's legacy.

In the short run, they (Obama and the media) can pin this on the conservatives, but those lousy historians will keep it tied right in with Obama's term.

I'm curious how far each party wants to go with this, as the deadline for a debt crisis, draws every closer.

I thought Obama did the right thing by calling the parties together to negotiate, and I'm not surprised that no actual negotiations took place. It's too early for that.

Time and tide, time and tide.