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Politics Where we learn not to think less of others who don't share our views |
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#1 | |
lurkin old school
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,796
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Found it! David Corn taking on the interpretation of an Iraqi visit in the big scheme of things. Oops to you?
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#2 |
I think this line's mostly filler.
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: DC
Posts: 13,575
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Another angle here. (And a Daily Kos thread discussing it)
There's also this Post story: Check the correction box on the side.
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_________________ |...............| We live in the nick of times. | Len 17, Wid 3 | |_______________| [pics] |
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#3 |
Radical Centrist
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Cottage of Prussia
Posts: 31,423
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I'm just glad we could get to the right part of the debate. Now we have everyone (except for the Post correction, which is a non-entity IMO) agreeing that:
1. Iraqi went to Niger. 2. They wanted uranium. (It's the only meaningful export Niger has.) 3. They were turned back. The Crooks and Liars take, which I have seen before, concludes that (and I quote) the intelligence community discounted the notion that Iraq was trying to buy uranium from Niger; but this is Monday morning, and given the 1-2-3 facts on the table, do you come to that conclusion? Isn't it a direct contradiction to #2? Why would Crooks and Liars do that? It gets hard to follow; but how did Wilson get those 1-2-3 facts? 4. He was a former ambassador, and highly regarded, but not an ambassador to Niger. He was ambassador to Gabon. It was 10 years ago. 5. When he went to Niger, he was told not to speak with anyone currently in the government because it could hurt further negotiations about the restrictions of yellowcake sale. 6. He was only there a week, and all he did was talk with people; they assured him that all was well and even though the Iraqis had been there, no transfer could have happened because of those restrictions. Here are the hard questions. Given 4-5-6, and the 1-2-3 already established, do YOU believe that Wilson could come to a very complete and total conclusion that Iraq was not seeking uranium? When Brit intelligence comes to the conclusion that Iraq was seeking to buy uranium from Niger, does Wilson's trip negate that intelligence? If you're Wilson, and the Pres makes his S.O.T.U. speech saying that Brit intel finds Iraq seeking uranium from Africa, do you then write to the New York Times about what you've found? Or do you wait six months until the war starts, the first invasion is over, and no stockpiles are found? When you write to the Times, do you omit fact #2? How about #4? How about #5? And finally, the biggest question for y'all: Is it OK that Iraq went to Niger in 1998 seeking uranium even though they were prohibited from having it? Are you copasetic with that because they did apparently get turned down? Do you think they wanted it for peaceful purposes? |
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#4 | |
I think this line's mostly filler.
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: DC
Posts: 13,575
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Quote:
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_________________ |...............| We live in the nick of times. | Len 17, Wid 3 | |_______________| [pics] |
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#5 |
Radical Centrist
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Cottage of Prussia
Posts: 31,423
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It's a correction, there's no by-line, and it contradicts everything in the Senate Intel Report specifically mentioned in the story. I'm saying it's flat-out wrong.
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#6 |
Radical Centrist
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Cottage of Prussia
Posts: 31,423
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Update on that: a poster in the dkos thread says that Iran has its own uranium mines. Some Googling around shows that to be true.
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#7 |
lurkin old school
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,796
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Do I want Iraq to buy uranium, make bombs and kill me? no.
Do I want the US to create manipulative intelligence to support their deadly move for regime change when they can't make a real case to put before the American people with fact? no. Why is Colin Powell so ashamed of it all? Why were these forgeries that supported the incorrect claim so ellusive, essential and crude? Would the British spread false intel, even for a little while? Would we? Why? Why not make a real case for war? Who would think of such a thing? How about Michael "Iran-Contra" Ledeenor one of his crowd? There's a track record of traitorous wheeling and dealing with national security secrets. Upon his return, talking with whoever and for however long, Wilson's intel was deemed good by the CIA who sent him. As the case for war was built, Wilson smelled a rat, and who knows what else he learned. That he came forward at all, well, that has proven to be a bold move. I will be very interested to see what Fitzgerald make of all of this mess. |
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#9 |
Radical Centrist
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Cottage of Prussia
Posts: 31,423
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chek chek chek
testing 1 2 3 is this thread on? |
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#10 |
erika
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: "the high up north"
Posts: 6,127
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uh... not since about a year ago...
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not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh |
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#11 | |||
Radical Centrist
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Cottage of Prussia
Posts: 31,423
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Hitchens put the whole thing together Tuesday, in Slate:
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And it concludes: Quote:
I was right this time, as I am 50% of the time, and I am bending over backwards to pat myself on the back for it. |
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#12 |
The future is unwritten
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 71,105
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Congratulations. Batting .500 is also a fantastic average.
That shows if you read, research, cross check, ask the right questions, wade through the rhetoric and bullcrap, dedicate the time, trouble and resources to the quest...... you too can be as accurate as flipping a coin. OK, I'm a smartass, but there has to be more to it. Personal satisfaction, dare I say even fun, like a hobby. One that's a hell of a lot cheaper and safer than most hobbies, too. I mean you still get only one vote at the polls unless you count people you influence or sway to your beliefs, your truth. The question is why do we even bother? Why not wait till it all comes out in the wash? Or will it not come out in the wash, if we the people don't demand it? I suppose they wouldn't bother with all the lies, spin and pure bullshit if people didn't care..... if people didn't question. I guess distracted or even dumb people don't really want to be sheeple. Even if they appear to be clueless or claim not to care about politics or international affairs, they don't want to be lied to, betrayed by the people they voted for. The fact that I'm rambling, thinking on the keyboard, proves i don't have the answer. Sorry, carry on. ![]()
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The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump. |
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#13 |
Read? I only know how to write.
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 11,933
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[quote=Undertoad Ya got that? The Plame "outer" is anti-Iraq war.[/QUOTE] One can only say that if a political agenda justifies the spin - lying by telling half truths. Armitage is a founding member of Project for New American Century. Does that sound like someone anti-Iraq war? He was Sec of State Powell's assistant and good friend. He was not anti-war as UT so intentionally misrepresents. Armitage was not a 'gun slinger' - somebody who would routinely and publicly lie to disparage others. UT, you knew that. Why then did you post that misrepresetation of Armitage – as only a ‘gun slinger’ would do?
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#14 |
still says videotape
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 26,813
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I didn't remember Armitage was PNAC, that does change things. I wonder why Schorr gave him a pass?
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If you would only recognize that life is hard, things would be so much easier for you. - Louis D. Brandeis |
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#15 | |
Makes some feel uncomfortable
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 10,346
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Quote:
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