London's Burning

[BigV]

Also Birmingham. Also Liverpool. Also Manchester.

HEY! UK Dwellars, check in *please*!!!


http://globalvoicesonline.org/2011/0...urning-videos/

http://www.forbes.com/feeds/ap/2011/...t_8609072.html

what the fucking fuck?

[grynch]

V... I'm not in England ( altho Mrs. G is from London way ) .. but we were both up late last night watching the news....

Don't know if you've read the background on this but the "tinder spark" was the Police shooting of a black man Thursday night, under what is being termed suspicious circumstance.

What was designed as a peaceful protest / vigil outside of the police HQ in the town where that happened turned into full scale rioting and looting... in the victims name.

since then what has been termed as recreational rioting has broken out in scattered parts of the city, and now last night in many different cities.

I personally doubt that any of these kids rioting and looting could name the man that was killed by police or even know he existed.... they are out only for a, pardon the expresssion, good time.

my opinion : break out the tear gas and the water canons.

[grynch]

http://news.sky.com/home/uk-news/article/16046145

[DanaC]

It's pretty horrible.

Watching the news it was just surreal.

It's like an orgy of violence and looting. What's disturbing is that so many of them are young, like really young.

Some of it seems to be due to the major disconnect between the police and the youngsters in these communities. This is the 'lost generation'. Interestingly, what appears to have sparked off at least one of the riots was apparently the police stop and searching a young lad (whom they then let go having found nothing). This seems to be a real grievance of young people now is that they are the ones being subjected to excessive stop and search these days.

Not that that's an excuse for rioting through the streets and setting fire to people's cars and property. But there are some serious questions that need asking about the relationship between police and the communities involved, particularly the youth.

I don't think it's a coincidence that this is happening when confidence in the Met is at an all time low. I'm not wholly sure what is at the root of this, but the police have one hell of a job on their hands in regaining confidence. I think the shooting just sat as an unfortunate symbol of a much deeper malaise.

[limey]

Can't add anything to what Grynch and Dana said. Checking in as asked, so far it is all quite a long way from where I am.

[grynch]

now THIS is my kinda place ....
http://gawker.com/5829018/michelin+s...rs-share-booze

Michelin-Starred Restaurant Staff Scare Looters, Share Booze

The kitchen staff at the Ledbury went beyond their call of duty by rushing up from the kitchen with rolling pins, fry baskets, and other dangerous kitchen tools and scared off the looters




also.. tonnes of stories on Facebook about groups organizing clean up of the streets and setting up food pantries for people that lost all due to fires.... the spirit of the Blitz lives on.

[chrisinhouston]

My father (now deceased) was British but became a US citizen in the 50's once told me that the British used to not have too many issues with public unrest because there was always a war every few years and then and the lower classes were always sent off to the front lines of battle and their ranks were thinned out enough that you didn't hear much from them until the next war.... and then they were gone again.

[glatt]

"Hey Mum, I'm just going to step out and do some looting. Cheers."

Where are these kids' parents?

[footfootfoot]

Originally Posted by DanaC

Interestingly, what appears to have sparked off at least one of the riots was apparently the police stop and searching a young lad (whom they then let go having found nothing). This seems to be a real grievance of young people now is that they are the ones being subjected to excessive stop and search these days.

Not that that's an excuse for rioting through the streets and setting fire to people's cars and property. But there are some serious questions that need asking about the relationship between police and the communities involved, particularly the youth.

I don't think it's a coincidence that this is happening when confidence in the Met is at an all time low. I'm not wholly sure what is at the root of this, but the police have one hell of a job on their hands in regaining confidence. I think the shooting just sat as an unfortunate symbol of a much deeper malaise.

We live up to the expectations people have of us.

[BigV]

thank you for checking in... one still absent... grrrr...


I listen pretty regularly to the BBC World Service, last night it was wall to wall coverage with one short exception which I can't remember just now. Anyhow, there was a statement by Cameron, ending with "Now, if you'll excuse me, there's work to be done." He characterized it as simple unacceptable criminality. I also heard one theory, swiftly rebutted, that there was an undercurrent of dissatisfaction over deep cuts to social programs, especially for youth. The (police officer?) local observer scoffed saying these kids would be pushed back by the police, and then jump in their souped up GTIs and scooting away a few blocks where the drivers would talk on their mobiles to reorganize their mates.

Astonishingly, there was an interview with a couple of girls, one was seventeen, who had participated, not just spectators, in the rioting and looting. These are kids, just kids really. They were typically difficult to comprehend, plus they were still a little drunk on rose wine, but they (thought they) were sticking it to the man (my phrase, their sentiment). "It's the government, innit?" They thought they were showing those who had money that they could do what they wanted. The reporter pointed out to the girls that shop keepers in the area are not really likely to be "rich". Seriously, why loot a nail shop? The booze, the clothes and electronics I can understand, though not condone.

The best program was World Have Your Say (I think) and the reporter was sitting with a handful of folks around a kitchen table in a house in Hackney. It was quite a free for all. Many thoughts were expressed, and the responsibilities of the parents to take charge of their kids was prominent. Teachers were also mentioned as influencers of these youth.

I see that an individual can feel taken advantage of, that they're not getting what they deserve. This is an uncomfortable feeling, and in their resentment and their desire for retribution, recompense they look to blame "the other". I believe that this blaming the other works for the rioters, the shop owners, the cops, the politicians, everybody. It's so much easier to see the motes in their eyes (myself included). But the only way out of any of this is to see through the others' eyes. Each side's story contains some truth. Work with that, listen to and validate that. At a minimum, you can't riot and empathize at the same time.

[BigV]

footfootfoot, that's true. it's also true that we live down to others' expectations of us.

Have high expectations.

[SamIam]

Some snips from here: http://old.news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110...u_britain_riot

Parliament will return to duty on Thursday, as the political fallout from the rampage takes hold. The crisis is a major test for Cameron's Conservative-led coalition government, which includes Liberal Democrats who had long suspected its program of harsh budget restraints could provoke popular dissent...

The rioters appeared to have little unifying cause — though some claimed to oppose sharp government spending cuts, which will slash welfare payments and cut tens of thousands of public sector jobs through 2015...

...as the latest unrest spread, some pointed to rising social tensions in Britain as the government slashes 80 billion pounds ($130 billion) from public spending by 2015 to reduce the huge deficit, swollen after the country spent billions bailing out its foundering banks.

"This is the uprising of the working class. We're redistributing the wealth," said Bryn Phillips, a 28-year-old self-described anarchist, as young people emerged from a store with chocolate bars and ice cream cones.

Power to the people! Chocolate and ice cream for everyone!

[grynch]

ohh.. frig......
just saw a facebook message from a friend

"omg, it's started down here now" ( eastbourne )

gonna be another long night

[Trilby]

Originally Posted by grynch

...rolling pins, fry baskets, and other dangerous kitchen tools...

Viciousness in the kitchen!

Seriously, never f*ck with the cooks. They're all coked-up and have cleavers.

[Undertoad]

as always, the fight for the narrative will be dirtier than the fight in the streets