"losers" with "no life" on Saturday night - Page 5

Flint · 08-10-2006, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaggieL

I can handle my relationship with God on my own, thanks.

Irrelevant. Your relationship with God isn't in question. You're dodging the issue.

Flint · 08-10-2006, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaggieL

It's the Islamofacists that worry me.

Take a look in your own backyard. You are a walking "hot button issue" . . .

MaggieL · 08-10-2006, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flint

Take a look in your own backyard. You are a walking "hot button issue" . . .

I can handle not being invited to the White House and not being able to marry my lifepartner if I can keep my guns and not have a stone wall pushed over on me. Notice that even Fred "God Hates Fags" Phelps has never shown up at a scheduled demonstration where the Pink Pistols had announced an intention to attend.

Don't lecture me about my backyard, son, I know where it is and who's in it. See "people like you" above. Note also that last month I was on one of the planes that was to be blown up this month.

Kitsune · 08-10-2006, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaggieL

It's the Islamofacists that worry me.

Why do they worry you?

Elspode · 08-10-2006, 06:13 PM

You're right, Maggie. Nothing like what is going on in the Middle East could ever happen *here*. It isn't like we're seeing signs of growing fascism and restriction of public freedoms in our country right now. It isn't like we aren't trying to force other countries to do things according to our principles. And even if we are, it is for our own good, our own security. No one in *this* country would ever abuse such powers, they'll just use them for good.

Yup, just fearmongering, that's me.

MaggieL · 08-10-2006, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elspode

Nothing like what is going on in the Middle East could ever happen *here*.

Sure it could. They have an expressed intention to deliver it.

Of course, it's moral equivalance time again...I'm sure you can tell us again how Dubya is "just as bad if not worse". Or not...you're preaching to the choir (can he get an amen?), and the sinners have heard it before too.

Urbane Guerrilla · 08-12-2006, 12:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elspode

It isn't like we're seeing signs of growing fascism and restriction of public freedoms in our country right now.

That sentiment is not visibly based on actual anti-fascism in this country. It is visibly based on anti-Republicanism, and it's too specious to take me in. Tell me, are you forbidden to buy killing tools and ammunition to feed them in your city? If you're part of the armed electorate, you're part of an electorate that is about as powerful as an electorate is likely to get.

Quote:

It isn't like we aren't trying to force other countries to do things according to our principles. And even if we are, it is for our own good, our own security.

If other countries did follow our principles -- the real ones, so no hollering about this piece of foreign policy or that, if you please -- they'd be one hell of a lot richer, happier, and more peaceful than they are now. In short, they'd be successes instead of sores on the global body politic.

Addressing your second sentence there, what is so damned wrong with the principle that a republic of, by, and for the etceteras would prosper best in a world with more republics so constituted, so conceived and so dedicated? A good many of the oh gag me, it's a neocon set seem to find some problem here -- but explain their actual objection? Never in a million years! That's because their root objection is that they're fucking fascists and the necons not only aren't, but are actively after exterminating the fascists/communists/antihumanists/rabid bloodsuckers. This prospect gives the fascisto-commies a very uncomfortable case of bunched panties and seatcushion sucking. Well, every bit of the shame is all theirs. They could have been real democrats, but they chose to fuck it up.

Flint · 08-10-2006, 02:30 PM

Fair enough. Pick your battles, I guess. If you are comfortable having to defend your right to exist by carrying a gun with you everywhere you go, then more power to you. If you feel better about not being blown up by a Muslim who believes you are abhorrent in the eyes of Allah, because you are being protected by a Christian who thinks you are abhorrent in the eyes of God, then who am I to point out that both of them feel the same way about you?

MaggieL · 08-10-2006, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flint

...who am I to point out that both of them feel the same way about you?

You're certainly not pointing out anything I don't know. I can't make a homophobe not hate me, and I don't care to try. (Which is one program the Dems are trying to sell with pointless "hate crime laws", by the way). My concern is with actions and capabilities, not feelings; a "hate crime" is defined by the state of mind of the perpetrator. Since we're all such Orwell fans: thoughtcrime, anyone?

I don't have to defend my right to exist by being an armed citizen, but I do choose to do so; it's my right and I won't give it up. Trading my birthright for the liberal's mess of pottage won't change the threats I face one whit. And homophobes aren't even at the top of my threat list; criminals who should be in prison but aren't rank much higher.

Should I really not feel better about being protected than about being blown up? Those are your words there...

Trilby · 08-11-2006, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaggieL

You're certainly not pointing out anything I don't know. I can't make a homophobe not hate me

Oh, but you could plant the seeds of change in their minds by being really, really charming...oh, wait, never mind.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaggieL

liberal's mess of pottage

Liberal Mess of Pottage would be a good name for a rock band.

MaggieL · 08-11-2006, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brianna

Oh, but you could plant the seeds of change in their minds by being really, really charming...oh, wait, never mind.

Being the Bill Cosby of Queer Nation? We have the Fab Five for that.

But "planting the seeds of change" in the minds of religious fundamentalists? Puhleeze.

But in fact, there's a kernel of truth at the core of that idea, strategically.

Demonstrating loudly for "gay rights" has given rise to the misperception of a "gay agenda for special privileges and recruiting our children"...and while Pride Parades full of leather boyz, topless dykes and rollerskating crossdressed nuns are fantastic for building a sense of community within the Gayborhood, they're not the best PR for disarming homophobia and fostering acceptance outside the Ghayto.

The US population as a whole isn't quite ready to embrace the idea of giving queer couples the same rights as straight ones. They're one hell of a lot closer than they were twenty, (even ten) years ago. Today it's not unthinkable for queer couples to live openly as queer couples in many areas...it's going to take a few years with that level of tolerance before the culture as a whole will be ready to take it to the next level, after living down the street for a while from that queer couple (who maybe even show up at the pistol range on third Saturdays) who turn out to be not all that different from "us normal folks".

"Affirmative action" and "hate crime" legislation reenforces the idea that what queer folks want is special privileges rather than equal rights. This is not a sensible part of a "charm offensive".

All that said, I intend to continue to be prepared to defend myself from any attacker...be they queerbasher, jihadi, or just a neighborhood crack or ice addict, and if that's not "charming" enough, too bad.

Undertoad · 08-10-2006, 06:26 PM

It's a matter of degree, and what can be accomplished in a free, modern, and educated society, as opposed to a backwards, uneducated one.

They put "In God We Trust" on the coins. They looked for patterns in overseas communications. They like eminent domain. Well Please, That Ain't Nothin'. Wake me when they cancel the elections.

Flint · 08-10-2006, 08:39 PM

It is simply a matter of being comitted to the wrong path. How far down that path you happen to have made it, so far, is not the issue so much as the stated intentions, the drive, towards moving things in the wrong direction. Monotheism and political monopolies are a horrible combination, regardless of which particular brand of monotheism.

xoxoxoBruce · 08-10-2006, 11:24 PM

Stockpile lots of ammo, it'll make great footage when the Apaches come.

MaggieL · 08-11-2006, 05:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

Stockpile lots of ammo, it'll make great footage when the Apaches come.

You do your threat assessment, I'll do mine.

Meanwhile you can stockpile lots of tinfoil.

08-10-2006, 06:13 PM	#5
Elspode When Do I Get Virtual Unreality? Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Raytown, Missouri Posts: 12,719	You're right, Maggie. Nothing like what is going on in the Middle East could ever happen here. It isn't like we're seeing signs of growing fascism and restriction of public freedoms in our country right now. It isn't like we aren't trying to force other countries to do things according to our principles. And even if we are, it is for our own good, our own security. No one in this country would ever abuse such powers, they'll just use them for good. Yup, just fearmongering, that's me. __________________ "To those of you who are wearing ties, I think my dad would appreciate it if you took them off." - Robert Moog

08-10-2006, 02:30 PM	#8
Flint Snowflake Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Dystopia Posts: 13,136	Fair enough. Pick your battles, I guess. If you are comfortable having to defend your right to exist by carrying a gun with you everywhere you go, then more power to you. If you feel better about not being blown up by a Muslim who believes you are abhorrent in the eyes of Allah, because you are being protected by a Christian who thinks you are abhorrent in the eyes of God, then who am I to point out that both of them feel the same way about you? __________________ **************** There's a level of facility that everyone needs to accomplish, and from there it's a matter of deciding for yourself how important ultra-facility is to your expression. ... I found, like Joseph Campbell said, if you just follow whatever gives you a little joy or excitement or awe, then you're on the right track. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Terry Bozzio** Last edited by Flint; 08-10-2006 at 02:41 PM.

08-10-2006, 08:39 PM	#13
Flint Snowflake Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Dystopia Posts: 13,136	It is simply a matter of being comitted to the wrong path. How far down that path you happen to have made it, so far, is not the issue so much as the stated intentions, the drive, towards moving things in the wrong direction. Monotheism and political monopolies are a horrible combination, regardless of which particular brand of monotheism. __________________ **************** There's a level of facility that everyone needs to accomplish, and from there it's a matter of deciding for yourself how important ultra-facility is to your expression. ... I found, like Joseph Campbell said, if you just follow whatever gives you a little joy or excitement or awe, then you're on the right track. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Terry Bozzio**

08-10-2006, 11:24 PM	#14
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	Stockpile lots of ammo, it'll make great footage when the Apaches come. __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

08-10-2006, 06:26 PM	#12
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	It's a matter of degree, and what can be accomplished in a free, modern, and educated society, as opposed to a backwards, uneducated one. They put "In God We Trust" on the coins. They looked for patterns in overseas communications. They like eminent domain. Well Please, That Ain't Nothin'. Wake me when they cancel the elections.

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