What would Martin Niemoller think about Arizona?

[classicman]

BREWSTER, Wash. — The Obama administration has replaced immigration raids at factories and farms with a quieter enforcement strategy: sending federal agents to scour companies’ records for illegal immigrant workers.
While the sweeps of the past commonly led to the deportation of such workers, the “silent raids,” as employers call the audits, usually result in the workers being fired, but in many cases they are not deported.

Over the past year, Immigration and Customs Enforcement has conducted audits of employee files at more than 2,900 companies. The agency has levied a record $3 million in civil fines so far this year on businesses that hired unauthorized immigrants, according to official figures. Thousands of those workers have been fired, immigrant groups estimate.

Employers say the audits reach more companies than the work-site roundups of the administration of President George W. Bush. The audits force businesses to fire every suspected illegal immigrant on the payroll— not just those who happened to be on duty at the time of a raid — and make it much harder to hire other unauthorized workers as replacements. Auditing is “a far more effective enforcement tool,” said Mike Gempler, executive director of the Washington Growers League, which includes many worried fruit growers.

Immigration inspectors who pored over the records of one of those growers, Gebbers Farms, found evidence that more than 500 of its workers, mostly immigrants from Mexico, were in the country illegally. In December, Gebbers Farms, based in this Washington orchard town, fired the workers.

“Instead of hundreds of agents going after one company, now one agent can go after hundreds of companies,” said Mark K. Reed, president of Border Management Strategies, a consulting firm in Tucson that advises companies across the country on immigration law. “And there is no drama, no trauma, no families being torn apart, no handcuffs.”

President Obama, in a speech last week, explained a two-step immigration policy. He promised tough enforcement against illegal immigration, in workplaces and at the border, saying it would prepare the way for a legislative overhaul to give legal status to millions of illegal immigrants already in the country. White House officials say the enforcement is under way, but they acknowledge the overhaul is unlikely to happen this year.

In another shift, the immigration agency has moved away from bringing criminal charges against immigrant workers who lack legal status but have otherwise clean records.

Republican lawmakers say Mr. Obama is talking tough, but in practice is lightening up.

“Even if discovered, illegal aliens are allowed to walk free and seek employment elsewhere” said Senator Jeff Sessions of Alabama, the senior Republican on the Judiciary Committee. “This lax approach is particularly troubling,” he said, “at a time when so many American citizens are struggling to find jobs.”

Link

An interesting plan - The penalty for an illegal being employed here is to lose their job, but they are allowed to walk free and remain in the country ... now unemployed.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Well except for criminal element escaping the law at home, aren't all these illegals coming here for work? Make it harder to find work and you take away the incentive for coming. Not as dramatic as machine gunning them down in the streets, but maybe as effective.

BUT, the border still must be secured, because not all of the interlopers are poor peasants looking for honest employment.

[classicman]

Yes you take away the incentive for coming. That must be part of the overall plan, but for those that are already here, why just let them walk away?
Doesn't this go back to the "we know how many are here, but we cannot find them?"
Well there were thousands. Yes a drop in the bucket, but its a start.

[xoxoxoBruce]

This way, they pay their own ticket home instead of you.

[piercehawkeye45]

Originally Posted by classicman

but for those that are already here, why just let them walk away?

Avoiding the costs of deportation? I'm assuming most will come back anyways.

[Lamplighter]

Originally Posted by classicman

Link

An interesting plan - The penalty for an illegal being employed here is to lose their job, but they are allowed to walk free and remain in the country ... now unemployed.

But on the next page of that link: (italics and underlining are mine)

"Many immigrants purchased new false documents and went looking for jobs in more distant orchards, former Gebbers Farms workers said.
But the word is out among growers in the region to avoid hiring immigrants from the company because ICE knows they are unauthorized."

Also, I'm taken by the political irony of these two sequential paragraphs.

“Even if discovered, illegal aliens are allowed to walk free and seek employment elsewhere” said Senator Jeff Sessions of Alabama, the senior Republican on the Judiciary Committee. “This lax approach is particularly troubling,” he said, “at a time when so many American citizens are struggling to find jobs.”

"Employers say the Obama administration is leaving them short of labor for some low-wage work, conducting silent raids but offering no new legal immigrant laborers in occupations, like farm work, that Americans continue to shun despite the recession. Federal labor officials estimate that more than 60 percent of farm workers in the United States are illegal immigrants."

I agree it is an "interesting plan"... sort of setting it up so the problems solve themselves.

That is, as word spreads that illegal immigrants can't find work, they don't come here illegally.
And when businesses stop breaking our laws by hiring those "low wage workers", and maybe have to raise their wages/prices the legal immigrants and/or unemployed Americans can take jobs with a livable wage.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Not if there's no work.

[classicman]

Originally Posted by Lamplighter

That is, as word spreads that illegal immigrants can't find work, they don't come here illegally.

I would think that there would have to be a better opportunity wherever they came from. This includes more than just the wages.

And when businesses stop breaking our laws by hiring those "low wage workers", and maybe have to raise their wages/prices the legal immigrants and/or unemployed Americans can take jobs with a livable wage.

As the wages rises so will the incentive for the illegals.
I think its a good start and something that was long overdue. The last administration should have been doing the same type of thing.

[Lamplighter]

Originally Posted by classicman

I would think that there would have to be a better opportunity wherever they came from. This includes more than just the wages.

As the wages rises so will the incentive for the illegals.
I think its a good start and something that was long overdue. The last administration should have been doing the same type of thing.

Amen

[lookout123]

The problem really isn't that hard to solve if the politicians and their owners wanted to fix it.

1) Use the E-verify system in every state to verify work eligibility. If a company is caught knowingly employing illegals the company has to shut it's doors for 10 days. Second offense is 30 days. Third offense is permanent. When the risk outweighs the rewards the employers will change their ways or cease to be employers.

2) Scrap the current complex immigration process. Legal immigration should be easier. If they can pass a simple but thorough background check let them in. Steady employment must be maintained as they will be ineligible for welfare benefits. If during the first 2 years they go more than 120 days unemployed, out they go.

Once those 2 steps are in place illegal immigration should all but stop for those who are just seeking a better way of life. The drug runners, human smugglers, and other criminals should be the only ones left trying to sneak in. Then start step 3.

3) Secure the border. That doesn't necessarily mean a wall across the southern US, but it does mean border patrol has the ability to patrol without interference. Anyone sneaking into the US is a criminal and they should be treated as such. Arrest them and return them using the Eisenhauer method of deportation. Don't return them to the border, ship them to southern mexico(or nothernmost part of canada ) and drop them off. If someone illegally entering the US violently engages US LE then the solution is simple - shoot them on the spot as you would any other violent invasion force.

of course none of that will happen because illegal immigration is a wonderful topic to keep the citizenry divided and controllable by those elected to serve us.

[classicman]

great points LO...

of course none of that will happen because illegal immigration is a wonderful topic to keep the citizenry divided and controllable by those elected to serve us.

The saddest truth of them all. But don't forget distracted as well.

[Lamplighter]

#1 The E-verify system already exists.
So if a business hires an "illegal" they are either doing so knowingly or they are purposely not being deligent.
(Ooops, did I forgot to check that felllow ???)

That's why I have no sympathy for businesses that get fined when they get caught or the politicians that support them.
But shut-downs probably have immediate ramifications for any "legal" employees of the company.

For the rest of what you say, I'm either in agreement or could live with it, especially your last line.

[Spexxvet]

Originally Posted by lookout123

The problem really isn't that hard to solve if the politicians and their owners wanted to fix it.

1) Use the E-verify system in every state to verify work eligibility. If a company is caught knowingly employing illegals the company has to shut it's doors for 10 days. Second offense is 30 days. Third offense is permanent. When the risk outweighs the rewards the employers will change their ways or cease to be employers.

2) Scrap the current complex immigration process. Legal immigration should be easier. If they can pass a simple but thorough background check let them in. Steady employment must be maintained as they will be ineligible for welfare benefits. If during the first 2 years they go more than 120 days unemployed, out they go.

Once those 2 steps are in place illegal immigration should all but stop for those who are just seeking a better way of life. The drug runners, human smugglers, and other criminals should be the only ones left trying to sneak in. Then start step 3.

3) Secure the border. That doesn't necessarily mean a wall across the southern US, but it does mean border patrol has the ability to patrol without interference. Anyone sneaking into the US is a criminal and they should be treated as such. Arrest them and return them using the Eisenhauer method of deportation. Don't return them to the border, ship them to southern mexico(or nothernmost part of canada ) and drop them off. If someone illegally entering the US violently engages US LE then the solution is simple - shoot them on the spot as you would any other violent invasion force.

of course none of that will happen because illegal immigration is a wonderful topic to keep the citizenry divided and controllable by those elected to serve us.

I really don't have an issue with any of that. I won't have a problem paying higher prices for products and services, and I won't have a problem with more federal government employees to do the work that will need to get done.

I'd also add:
Knowingly employing an undocumented alien makes you inelligible for public office.

Undocumented aliens who are treated at a hospital and can't pay will be stablized and deported.

[classicman]

Utah agencies probe alleged illegal immigrant list

State agencies are investigating whether any of their employees leaked Social Security numbers and other personal information after a list of 1,300 people who an anonymous group claims are illegal immigrants was circulated around Utah.

The anonymous group mailed the list to several media outlets, law enforcement agencies and others this week, frightening the state's Hispanic community. A letter accompanying the list demanded that those on it be deported immediately.

The list also contains highly detailed personal information such as Social Security numbers, birth dates, workplaces, addresses and phone numbers. Names of children are included, along with due dates of pregnant women on the list.

Republican Gov. Gary Herbert wrote in a tweet Tuesday that he has asked state agencies to investigate the list's origin.

"We've got some people in our technology department looking at it right now," said Dave Lewis, communication for the state Department of Workforce Services. "It's a high priority. We want to figure out the how's and why's."

Just a couple thoughts ... How bout finding out why this group can do your job better than you can? Oh and if they are illegal - enforce the law.

Lewis noted his department is one of several with access to the information included in the list. He said his agency didn't receive a copy of the list from the governor's office until late Tuesday.

Most of the names on the list are of Hispanic origin.

"My phone has been ringing nonstop since this morning with people finding out they're on the list," said Tony Yapias, former director of the Utah Office of Hispanic Affairs. "They're feeling terrorized. They're very scared."

Link
Gee really??? Perhaps thats because they are here illegally?

[xoxoxoBruce]

She noted that because ICE has finite resources, it focuses its efforts "first on those dangerous convicted criminal aliens who present the greatest risk to the security of our communities, not sweeps or raids to target undocumented immigrants indiscriminately.

Then you're not doing your cushy government job, bitch.