The Power of Now

[lumberjim]

I've been trying not to preach. Trying to offer counterpoint. This works for me. Maybe a few others that aren't speaking here. All it really amounts to is increased self awareness. That seems to piss you off. Why?

[sexobon]

Well (hole in the ground, about 50 ft. deep, you get water out of it), when you go on and on about it you make it sound like it's THE solution rather than an adjunct to the natural grieving process. It makes it seem that you're trying to reduce lives to the status of property the loss of which is easier to deal with. There's nothing new under the sun with the power of now. It's just a distraction. It's just trying to keep your mind off your loses until time heals all wounds as people have done forever. Thinking that you've got a panacea is purely egotistical. The kind of ego that can't be bruised by a balanced concern over it's role in matters past, present, and future. It eventually makes one expendable in other people's lives leading to failed relationships. Other than that it's mox nix. Good luck with that.

[lumberjim]

No, it's not new. I don't think it's a cure all either. I've been going on in this thread because that's what this thread is.

So easy to confuse what I'm describing as apathy. Not at all the case. And it's clearly not for everyone. Since the only ones commenting at this point are apparently irritated by the concepts, I guess there's no need to continue sharing what I'm learning. Your opinion of what's going on with me is not correct. Probably in large part due to the limited info you get from what I post here and what I feel. It's not really possible to describe with words because words are by definition thought.

Your comments on this topic, in particular, have seemed either self congratulatory or condescending. I understand that the same inaccuracy exists in my interpretation of your posts. You probably don't intend to be that way.

So, you said what you said, and unless you actually are trying to troll me, it's all good in the hood.

So yeah, let this thread fade. I'm done.

[Undertoad]

I think it's similar to Buddhist meditation, which is so deep in humanity, it predates Christianity.

makes one expendable in other people's lives leading to failed relationships

Ironic, because due to the warm relationship building you have done in this thread, people have asked me privately if you should be banned.

That's way worse than "expendable". It's not that they don't care if you are around. They actually want you gone.

Relationship expert, counsel thyself.

[Griff]

Originally Posted by Undertoad

I think it's similar to Buddhist meditation, which is so deep in humanity, it predates Christianity.

I read Tolle years ago. I was struck that it was pretty derivative of Buddhism but maybe more accessible for a Western audience. I guess I'm one of those who has been largely silent on this thread who finds some peace in trying to go through life informed by this. Some folks believe this kind of thinking could make us too accepting of things that should be fought, maybe this is where Bruce is coming from?

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by Griff

Some folks believe this kind of thinking could make us too accepting of things that should be fought, maybe this is where Bruce is coming from?

Nah, I'm just a contrary prick.
I can see pitfalls in most cut and dried philosophies, also in ones winging it like Jim Jones and David Koresh. Maybe after Trump's war we can get better thinking.

[sexobon]

So what's new?

The power of now compels me.

[lumberjim]

What's new is the attention I'm paying to my own reactions. This would have devolved into a flame fest if I had not been.

Mocking me isn't very nice. I may be wrong, but I expect you're intent is to get a reaction so you can then show me that I'm wrong. That's ok, but I'm not trying to be right or show you that you're wrong in this thread, so... . I hope you didn't take it that way. I was just trying to point to something I find useful.

I'm not a case study. I'm your friend. Peace

[sexobon]

Hmmm, I dunno, you once said that if someone doesn't post their picture in the Cellar they can't be your friend and I still haven't done that.

You've seen for yourself that it's not just me. I'm just the one who's not going to pussyfoot around with you. While you're certainly entitled to your own opinions, you are not entitled to your own facts. As long as you're just trying to point to something that YOU find useful, it's all good.

I'm not looking for any reaction, just to keep opinions in perspective. There's no trolling or flame war. If that was my intention, I would have laid into you from the start. I'm responding as you demonstrate you can handle my responses. Others may think you need to be coddled. I do not. My sword is mighty; but, my pen is mightier. If I decide to virtually attack someone here, I'll leave no doubt in their mind. Peace, and long life.

[lumberjim]

The only fact I've offered is that everything unfolds in the present moment.

The rest is my opinion and advice.

I think you're right. I was wrong when I said that about the pictures. I have a clear image of most of you without them. And they don't really matter. The intent of that statement wasn't truly literal though, anyway. What I think I meant at the time was that if you're guarded and unwilling to share your real self (maybe a photo was a bad example) then we can't really share and connect as friends are wont to do.

Your sword and pen are just as impressive as your empathy.

[lumberjim]

Sadhguru says in the opening of his book, Inner Engineering, that the present moment... Shtick... Can be dangerous. Can cause stagnation. I'm reading that now. I can see your point. As in all things, moderation.

Perhaps it's important to be more specific about my personal context. At times of crisis, Tolle is a powerful teacher. When things are normal, others may have more to offer. Or maybe we need all of it at once.

I'm learning. I'm not qualified to instruct. I offer this Now stuff here as a resource for times of trouble. Your mileage will vary.

[sexobon]

Consider it in light of the Serenity Prayer:

Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference.

Use an applicable method or technique as a tool; but, not as a crutch. It shouldn't interfere with acquiring the wisdom to know the difference between what you should accept and what you should change. When someone extols the virtue of a method/technique disproportionate to other applicable ones, it raises a red flag that it could be being used as a crutch. Crutches are symptomatic treatment and don't treat the underlying cause. Crutches alone may seem like a quick way around a problem; but, the short-term gain may not outweigh creating a long-term dependency on them. If one presents as overly reliant on a method/technique, hopefully one's friends will seek to help balance them out.

Becoming balanced depends various factors including a person's Power of Humility (in the psychology sense). The stronger the ego, the harder a well balanced position is to achieve. The tendency is to want to simply manage adversity through force of will. The Power of Humility; however, is more a leadership function than a management one. The Power of Humility makes for strong leaders; because, those who have it listen to others and allow them to help resolve issues rather than just telling them how it's going to be done. The power of humility takes one from just talking the talk, to walking the walk. The Power of Now always has its place. Its appeal has a tendency; however, to become exaggerated in those who don't make the Power of Humility cut.

[lumberjim]

Originally Posted by Sadhguru

There are many spurious and dangerously misleading teachings in vogue in our world today. “Be in the moment” is one of them. The assumption is that you could be somewhere else, if you wanted. How is that even possible? The present is the only place that you can be. If you live, you live in this moment. If you die, you die in this moment. This moment is eternity. How are you going to escape it, even if you try?Right now your problem is that you suffer what happened ten years ago and you suffer what may happen the day after tomorrow. Both are not living truths. They are simply a play of your memory and imagination. Does this mean then that in order to find peace you must annihilate your mind? Not at all. It simply means you need to take charge of it. Your mind carries the enormous reserves of memory and the incredible possibilities of the imagination that are the result of an evolutionary process of millions of years. If you can use it when you want and put it aside when you don’t, the mind can be a fantastic tool. To shun the past and neglect the future is to trivialize this wonderful faculty. So “be in the moment” becomes a crippling psychological restriction—it denies our existential reality.

I found a pdf of that book. Is this your concern, bruce?
I agree that if I was to ONLY live in the moment, this would be an issue. What I'm doing is working on the capability. Being Able to center myself when I choose to. Not to live in that place all day every day.


And once again, I apologize if anyone took this as preaching. It's a tricky thing. I found great usefulness, and want to share it. Easy to slip into preaching mode. To be persuasive about it.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by lumberjim

I found a pdf of that book. Is this your concern, bruce?

A little of that but far from the rant sadhguru goes on.
Just in this thread you and Toad have introduced a bunch of philosophies that sometimes jibe and sometimes grate on each other. I guess they are like food stores, pick and choose from each to write your own menu.

I agree that if I was to ONLY live in the moment, this would be an issue. What I'm doing is working on the capability. Being Able to center myself when I choose to. Not to live in that place all day every day.

And once again, I apologize if anyone took this as preaching. It's a tricky thing. I found great usefulness, and want to share it. Easy to slip into preaching mode. To be persuasive about it.

That was probably a poor choice of words on my part, I used preaching as a shorthand for endorsing, expounding on, sharing new to you information with vigor. That's normal when you find something you feel is interesting and want to share it with friends. Didn't mean for it to sound judgmental, if I did I'm sorry.

I can certainly see the value of focusing on the task at hand without my mind wandering to the faux pas I committed at dinner with friends last Saturday, or the thing I promised to do next Tuesday.

If I'm doing something I fucked up before, I want to remember where I went wrong if I figured that out, but not dwell on the failure.

[sexobon]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

… but not dwell on the failure.

But, but, you're a dwellar! Maybe you're actually one of them cellarites.