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Philosophy Religions, schools of thought, matters of importance and navel-gazing |
View Poll Results: Should a police officer be fired for joining the Klan | |||
Kick him out no matter what |
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17 | 65.38% |
Reinstate him if he stays out of the Klan |
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2 | 7.69% |
Reinstate him no matter what he does off duty |
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7 | 26.92% |
Voters: 26. You may not vote on this poll |
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#166 | |
in the Hour of Scampering
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Jeffersonville PA (15 mi NW of Philadelphia)
Posts: 4,060
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Quote:
Or are you confusing when a crime has been comitted with if a crime has been comitted? The if question is settled by the operation of the legal system
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"Neither can his Mind be thought to be in Tune,whose words do jarre; nor his reason In frame, whose sentence is preposterous..." |
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#167 | ||||
Goon Squad Leader
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Seattle
Posts: 27,063
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Quote:
I'm sorry you're confused. Naturally, the answer to the question of "if" must precede the answer to the question of "when". That answer may be obvious, but often it is not. The answer may also render moot the question of "when". Is that clearer for you? Quote:
This section: Quote:
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#168 |
To shreds, you say?
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: in the house and on the street-how many, many feet we meet!
Posts: 18,449
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Were Ken Lay's actions re: Enron criminal?
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The internet is a hateful stew of vomit you can never take completely seriously. - Her Fobs |
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#169 |
Wearing her bitch boots
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Floriduh
Posts: 1,181
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I think there is a difference between threatening bodily harm and threats of other potentially criminal activities.
If Joe Shmoe threatens to blow my head off, he has already committed the crime of assault. If he has a gun at the time of the threat, it is assault with a deadly weapon. The law allows a person to defend themselves if their life is threatened. The threat must be immediate and believable in order to use deadly force as a defense. Some states require a person to actually attempt a retreat before they can become aggressive in this defense, but others say the threat itself is enough. IE: If Joe Shmoe has a water gun and is squirting me with it, telling me he's going to send me to my next life, I would be unable to justify (in court) the use of a real gun to shoot HIM with because the threat was not believable. Or lets say Joe Shmoe tells me he is going to blow my head off during a bar brawl. If I go home, sleep it off, then go buy a gun and go shoot Joe Shmoe a day or two later, this won't fly because the threat was not immediate. However, if Joe Shmoe threatens to steal all my money, it is just a threat. If I were a wise person, I would take steps to ensure my money was safe but unless he actually snatches my money away, he hasn't committed a crime. The definition of what is and when a crime occurs varies depending on the crime itself. The Supreme court (state and/or federal) decides how to apply these definitions in cases where there is a dispute. Stormie
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"First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." - Mahatma Gandhi |
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#170 | |
Goon Squad Leader
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Seattle
Posts: 27,063
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Quote:
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#171 | |
To shreds, you say?
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: in the house and on the street-how many, many feet we meet!
Posts: 18,449
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Quote:
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The internet is a hateful stew of vomit you can never take completely seriously. - Her Fobs |
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#172 | |
in the Hour of Scampering
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Jeffersonville PA (15 mi NW of Philadelphia)
Posts: 4,060
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Quote:
As for Mr. Lay...he got busted, he's been convicted, his appeals aren't exhausted. Things are looking pretty good for him ending up a convict. If you're asking if I would have voted to convict were I on the jury (I was almost on a jury today, by the way...they turned out not to need me), I couldn't say, since I didn't spend umpty-leven days listening to the evidence. BigV...what exactly was it that 9th was saying that you're interested in? I seem to recall that he was doing the "preemptive use of force" riff with Bruce. {L/l}ibertarians (especially the big-L variety) are very fond of the "non-initiation of violence" dealie...and it *is* a conforting shibboleth. Personally I don't hew to it strictly; I beleve I have a right to use deadly force in self defence should I reasonably believe I (or someone else) is in danger of death or grevious bodily harm. I'm comfortable with the justification statue here in the Commonwealth and don't beleive it restricts my options unreasonably. My Gwennie has a theory that force used in self-defence does not meet a proper definition of the term "violence", but people's eyes usually glaze over when she tries to lay it down.
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"Neither can his Mind be thought to be in Tune,whose words do jarre; nor his reason In frame, whose sentence is preposterous..." |
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#173 | |
Guest
Posts: n/a
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Quote:
I don't believe that one has the right to do that when others count on them. |
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#174 | ||||
Goon Squad Leader
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Seattle
Posts: 27,063
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Quote:
Quote:
This: Quote:
This Quote:
I'm believe in self defense, of course. And I'm not really interested in mincing words with you or anyone else as to the :rollseyes: difference between crime conviction intention violence etc etc. I was trying to understand you. And rkzenrage, too. Understand more thoroughly than just knowing the definitions of the words displayed. That takes more effort, and is almost always worth it. The words are important, too; don't get me wrong. But understanding the words without understanding the meaning is like seeing and smelling a delicious meal you may not taste. It does not nourish or satisfy.
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#175 | |
Goon Squad Leader
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Seattle
Posts: 27,063
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Quote:
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#176 | |
To shreds, you say?
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: in the house and on the street-how many, many feet we meet!
Posts: 18,449
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Quote:
Of cat skinning, the ways are many. BigV has already pointed out that Mr. Lay (by faking his death, he's living on a compund with Jim Morrison and a few others, possibly Ayn Rand) has neatly avoided having any guilt associated with his name...
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#177 | |
in the Hour of Scampering
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Jeffersonville PA (15 mi NW of Philadelphia)
Posts: 4,060
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Quote:
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"Neither can his Mind be thought to be in Tune,whose words do jarre; nor his reason In frame, whose sentence is preposterous..." |
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#178 | ||
in the Hour of Scampering
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Jeffersonville PA (15 mi NW of Philadelphia)
Posts: 4,060
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Quote:
He was convicted, and as you point out, if the abatement isn't pursued, the conviction will stand. Exactly what "crime-ness" might mean I do not know. Behavior is recognized as criminal or not through the operation of the criminal justice system. Quote:
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"Neither can his Mind be thought to be in Tune,whose words do jarre; nor his reason In frame, whose sentence is preposterous..." |
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#179 | |
Goon Squad Leader
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Seattle
Posts: 27,063
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Quote:
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#180 |
bent
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: under the weather
Posts: 2,656
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Civil rights are what they are. But I'm afraid that radical islamists are going to use our own squeamishness about all things race-related as a weapon to kill more of us.
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Sìn a nall na cuaranan sin. -- Cha mhór is fheairrde thu iad, tha iad coltach ri cat air a dhathadh |
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