Wall Street Protests - Page 20

DanaC · 10-23-2011, 06:54 PM

On Have I Got News For You, this weekend one of the guests, Louise Mensch, who is a Conservative MP made a comment about having seen protestors queing to get into Starbucks and playing with their i-phones.

The other guests all picked up on that. Paul Merton asked 'So, if they buy a cup of coffee their opinion is worthless?'

classicman · 10-23-2011, 07:12 PM

A) Yep just like his.
B) Why/with what are they buying Starbucks for if they are "so poor"?

DanaC · 10-23-2011, 07:17 PM

a) I don't understand this. Just like whose what?

b) Who said anything about them being 'poor'?

classicman · 10-23-2011, 07:20 PM

The stereotypers.

DanaC · 10-23-2011, 07:22 PM

Ahhh. Ok. I misunderstood your point entirely ;P

classicman · 10-23-2011, 07:25 PM

Stormieweather · 10-23-2011, 10:20 PM

What, because I work 2 jobs and have a nice house, does that mean I have to STFU?

I'm not poor and I'm one of the 99%'ers. I don't think this country is heading in the right direction, so I'm all for speaking up about it (ie: protests). These people who imply that just because we have nice things (that we worked our asses off for) we don't have a right to bitch about money in politics, the unfair state of our tax system, the financial rape of our country and the lack of concern from our leaders over it? Excuuuuuuuse me??

(not you guys, the stereotyping observers)

gvidas · 10-23-2011, 10:39 PM

I think it's important to find a good way to convince people who really want to be part of the 1% that they're getting boned. That seems to be the demographic who is most unreceptive to the idea, anyway.

Flint · 10-24-2011, 12:50 AM

Is the point of all this that "rich" = bad person? When I listen to some people talk, this seems to be an implicit assumption they have. This is, by the way, a horrible, horrible, destructive idea. And one that falls apart on even the slightest examination. But, critical thinking is never really "popular" is it?

DanaC · 10-24-2011, 03:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flint

Is the point of all this that "rich" = bad person? When I listen to some people talk, this seems to be an implicit assumption they have. This is, by the way, a horrible, horrible, destructive idea. And one that falls apart on even the slightest examination. But, critical thinking is never really "popular" is it?

Y'know, i really don't think that's the point at all. If it were then the protests and the Occupy movement would have kicked off years ago. This isn't abour rich people and poor people. It's about the way some of the very richest in society are controlling the whole picture, and sacrificing the health and well-being of the rest of the nation (in each instance) for their own financial gain.

I hear far more unpleasant and judgemental things from the right about the 'poor', or indeed about anybody who expresses a problem with the current tax system, or with the current grotesque levels of inequality in society, than anything I've heard about 'the rich'.

ZenGum · 10-24-2011, 06:34 AM

That is why I liked that NYT op-ed so much. The plutocrats are doing anything they can to deflect attention away from the real criticism of plutocracy itself.

Here is my first draft of an OWS manifesto.

We're not demanding the end of capitalism. We're not demanding that everyone gets an iphone. We don't want to take the iphones or even the Ferraris away from those who have them.

We want political power brought back to a more democratic level, from the massive bias in favour of the rich we have now. We want the tax loopholes and other financial advantages closed off, and we want politicians who are not too spineless to do this. We want reckless casino capitalism regulated so that international financiers can no longer gamble with the fate of the whole economy, keeping the winnings and dumping the losses on the tax payer.

Thoughts?

sexobon · 10-24-2011, 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZenGum

... We want political power brought back to a more democratic level, from the massive bias in favour of the rich we have now. We want the tax loopholes and other financial advantages closed off, and we want politicians who are not too spineless to do this. We want reckless casino capitalism regulated so that international financiers can no longer gamble with the fate of the whole economy, keeping the winnings and dumping the losses on the tax payer.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Undertoad

I'd sign up for that.

Better that than an OWS movement modeled on the OSF* movement.

*Occupy Sherwood Forest

Spexxvet · 10-24-2011, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flint

Is the point of all this that "rich" = bad person?

My understanding of it is that there is a huge, dangerous debt/deficit problem in the US, and the poor and middle class cannot fix it. It's up to the "rich" and corporations to step up.

tw · 10-24-2011, 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spexxvet

My understanding of it is that there is a huge, dangerous debt/deficit problem in the US, and the poor and middle class cannot fix it.

Clinton had no problems fixing it. He fixed the tax structure by having everyone pay fair amount of taxes. What resulted was job increases and reduced deficits. Funny how many want to solve this problem with no taxes.

Michelle Bachman is a perfect example of one so many approved of. She was asked how much of every dollar should go to taxes. She said none. In a next question, she then said defense spending should be increased. Why do so many believe this nonsense? So many even foolishly insist lower taxes mean more jobs. Well, tax cuts last decade resulted in how many more jobs this decade? At what point does the word 'liar' apply?

What worked previously? It will work again. But as Obama so accurately noted, it will take at least a decade to fix a mess created by politicians and their money gamers between 2000 and 2008.

How many $billions did we have to spend only to get bin Laden because someone all but protected bin Laden? Never forget why we have so many debts. "Reagan proved that deficits don't matter." Not when he was creating them a political agenda. Now we must increase taxes to pay for those deficits. No way around reality - no matter how often Bachman, et al ignore that reality.

classicman · 10-24-2011, 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tw

Michelle Bachman is a perfect example of one so many approved of.

Whoa. Most of your post makes sense, but this part - "So many"
I'm still trying to figure out who elected her and why ANYONE is paying attention to her. She's batshit insane and should be rendered to the irrelevant pile.

10-23-2011, 07:12 PM	#2
classicman barely disguised asshole, keeper of all that is holy. Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 23,401	A) Yep just like his. B) Why/with what are they buying Starbucks for if they are "so poor"? __________________ "like strapping a pillow on a bull in a china shop" Bullitt

10-23-2011, 07:20 PM	#4
classicman barely disguised asshole, keeper of all that is holy. Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 23,401	The stereotypers. __________________ "like strapping a pillow on a bull in a china shop" Bullitt

10-23-2011, 07:25 PM	#6
classicman barely disguised asshole, keeper of all that is holy. Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 23,401	__________________ "like strapping a pillow on a bull in a china shop" Bullitt

10-23-2011, 10:20 PM	#7
Stormieweather Wearing her bitch boots Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Floriduh Posts: 1,181	What, because I work 2 jobs and have a nice house, does that mean I have to STFU? I'm not poor and I'm one of the 99%'ers. I don't think this country is heading in the right direction, so I'm all for speaking up about it (ie: protests). These people who imply that just because we have nice things (that we worked our asses off for) we don't have a right to bitch about money in politics, the unfair state of our tax system, the financial rape of our country and the lack of concern from our leaders over it? Excuuuuuuuse me?? (not you guys, the stereotyping observers) __________________ "First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." - Mahatma Gandhi

10-24-2011, 12:50 AM	#9
Flint Snowflake Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Dystopia Posts: 13,136	Is the point of all this that "rich" = bad person? When I listen to some people talk, this seems to be an implicit assumption they have. This is, by the way, a horrible, horrible, destructive idea. And one that falls apart on even the slightest examination. But, critical thinking is never really "popular" is it? __________________ **************** There's a level of facility that everyone needs to accomplish, and from there it's a matter of deciding for yourself how important ultra-facility is to your expression. ... I found, like Joseph Campbell said, if you just follow whatever gives you a little joy or excitement or awe, then you're on the right track. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Terry Bozzio**

10-23-2011, 10:39 PM	#8
gvidas Hoodoo Guru Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 286	I think it's important to find a good way to convince people who really want to be part of the 1% that they're getting boned. That seems to be the demographic who is most unreceptive to the idea, anyway.

10-24-2011, 06:34 AM	#11
ZenGum Doctor Wtf Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Badelaide, Baustralia Posts: 12,861	That is why I liked that NYT op-ed so much. The plutocrats are doing anything they can to deflect attention away from the real criticism of plutocracy itself. Here is my first draft of an OWS manifesto. We're not demanding the end of capitalism. We're not demanding that everyone gets an iphone. We don't want to take the iphones or even the Ferraris away from those who have them. We want political power brought back to a more democratic level, from the massive bias in favour of the rich we have now. We want the tax loopholes and other financial advantages closed off, and we want politicians who are not too spineless to do this. We want reckless casino capitalism regulated so that international financiers can no longer gamble with the fate of the whole economy, keeping the winnings and dumping the losses on the tax payer. Thoughts? __________________ Shut up and hug. MoreThanPretty, Nov 5, 2008. Just because I'm nominally polite, does not make me a pussy. Sundae Girl.

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