School shooting du jour - Page 3

warch · 03-23-2005, 06:41 PM

The kid was sick, he lacked a net, he was living in isolation, he had access to weapons. I'm not quick to bag on the teachers 'cause they're in the firing range and most every teacher I know would tune in as close as possible and take a bullet for any kid in their care. The only thing I think that could have impacted this case positively would have been close psych treatment at a very young age. But he's moving from Mpls to living in a poor res community and easy to miss. I think its weird that he was a self described native nazi.

xoxoxoBruce · 03-24-2005, 09:40 PM

It's those damn Indian swastikas again.....led him astray.

BigV · 03-24-2005, 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigV

Their reaction
This cannot be prevented. And the cost of the futile exercise of attempting to do so is far far greater than even the cost of what has happened today.

This school had everything going for it. They've had an emergency plan in place, since before the Columbine tragedy. Metal detectors. Security guards. Teachers trained to be first responders. Drills.

And still so many dead. The kid entered the building at 2:55, the police arrived at 2:57, and at 3:05, it was all over.

How can this be prevented? Who would want their children to pay the costs for certainty of preventing bad things from happening to them. Easy but expensive. Just dip them all in carbonite.

xoxoxoBruce · 03-26-2005, 10:26 AM

Prevented? Can't, It's always happened and always will.
The best we can do is slow 'em down by letting them all know they have someone who will listen to them NOW. Not when we have time...later....someday.
If you dip them in carbonite, how do you hold them...by the heel?

grazzers · 03-26-2005, 03:02 PM

Excuse me for being a bit of an inexperienced debater, but here goes.

Although I know tightening gun laws will not solve the school shooting problems in America completely, it will help. Gun laws are strict here in Britian, and the last big school shooting was 9 years ago in Dunblane, and before that it was practically unheard of. There are still bullies and school nutjobs (trust me, im still in secondary school, i KNOW), some are capable of real violence, (there used to be a 16 year old in one of my classes who was sent to jail for a while for hospitalising a stranger over some petty arguement), and this is a comparatively safe, decent school. There are a lot worse schools out there in Scotland, with pupils with less hope for the future and a lot more rage.

The thing is, their means of release is a lot more restricted. People still get bullied and beaten up, which is bad, but at least no-one gets shot.

We are by no means free from problems here though. 2 days ago an 11 year old girl commited suicide, Scotlands youngest suicide to date. A couple of weeks ago a young boy was shot dead by a man shooting at firefighters with an airgun, sparking a debate on stricter airgun laws. Banning guns will not solve the problems with todays youth, but it would partially reduce some of the risks involved in being young.

lookout123 · 03-26-2005, 08:26 PM

the problem is that stricter gun laws only keep guns out of the hands of people who follow the law. criminals aren't overly concerned about the laws. and as far as the number of school shooting you have? compare the number of kids you have in each schools times the number of schools you have to similar statistics in the US... see something a little obvious here? we have a lot more kids in a lot more schools so shootings will be more frequent here. but that is irrelevant, only comparing shootings per capita would be appropriate.

tw · 03-27-2005, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lookout123

the problem is that stricter gun laws only keep guns out of the hands of people who follow the law.

And driver's licenses only keep the good drivers off the road. Criminals don't bother with driver's licenses. They just keep driving. We should eliminate the driver's license for the exact same reason.

jaguar · 03-27-2005, 12:42 PM

Considering in the UK there have been numerous incidents and drive-bys with AK-47s and MAC-10s not to mention police raids picking up plastique, grenades, assult rifles and semi-auto pistols I don't think banning guns solves the problem. The situation is so bad in nottingham now that police are armed on patrol for the first time in the UK. Fix the social stuff and the rest will fix itself.

xoxoxoBruce · 03-27-2005, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tw

And driver's licenses only keep the good drivers off the road. Criminals don't bother with driver's licenses. They just keep driving. We should eliminate the driver's license for the exact same reason.

What!?!?

Interrupt a major revenue source? Not the licenses, the ticket revenue that licenses allow them to collect.
And without licenses they'd issue National ID cards.

wolf · 03-28-2005, 01:30 AM

Licenses are poised to become the national ID cards.

I often wish I could do without, but I've observed the problems a friend who steadfastly won't have one has had. I also like driving too much.

BigV · 03-28-2005, 09:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolf

Licenses are poised to become the national ID cards.

Not in Utah.

Troubleshooter · 03-28-2005, 10:55 AM

Oh no!

We can't put any restrictions on illegal aliens!

What would that do to our trade and political negotiations with Mexico?

The horror!

wolf · 03-28-2005, 11:02 AM

I'll get back to you on that once I figure out what they have that we want ...

Cheap whores ... weed ... brightly colored serapes and sombreros ...

I'll think of it at some point.

mrnoodle · 03-28-2005, 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolf

I'll get back to you on that once I figure out what they have that we want ...

Cheap whores ... weed ... brightly colored serapes and sombreros ...

what's your point? I guess whores are kinda nasty, but as for the rest, viva mexico, baby.

tw, licenses are all fine and dandy, but when they start banning cars because of bad drivers, then you'll have your parallel correct.

lookout123 · 03-28-2005, 11:30 AM

no, no - let tw continue to live in his carefully crafted world of overreaction, oversimplification, and bad analogies. it is for his own good. can you imagine a day when he wakes up to find that the world doesn't fit into this nice little cubby holes he has designed?

Wolf will be getting a visit.

03-24-2005, 09:40 PM	#32
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	It's those damn Indian swastikas again.....led him astray. __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

03-26-2005, 10:26 AM	#34
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	Prevented? Can't, It's always happened and always will. The best we can do is slow 'em down by letting them all know they have someone who will listen to them NOW. Not when we have time...later....someday. If you dip them in carbonite, how do you hold them...by the heel? __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

03-26-2005, 03:02 PM	#35
grazzers Aim for the Best Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Edinburgh, Scotland Posts: 134	Excuse me for being a bit of an inexperienced debater, but here goes. Although I know tightening gun laws will not solve the school shooting problems in America completely, it will help. Gun laws are strict here in Britian, and the last big school shooting was 9 years ago in Dunblane, and before that it was practically unheard of. There are still bullies and school nutjobs (trust me, im still in secondary school, i KNOW), some are capable of real violence, (there used to be a 16 year old in one of my classes who was sent to jail for a while for hospitalising a stranger over some petty arguement), and this is a comparatively safe, decent school. There are a lot worse schools out there in Scotland, with pupils with less hope for the future and a lot more rage. The thing is, their means of release is a lot more restricted. People still get bullied and beaten up, which is bad, but at least no-one gets shot. We are by no means free from problems here though. 2 days ago an 11 year old girl commited suicide, Scotlands youngest suicide to date. A couple of weeks ago a young boy was shot dead by a man shooting at firefighters with an airgun, sparking a debate on stricter airgun laws. Banning guns will not solve the problems with todays youth, but it would partially reduce some of the risks involved in being young. __________________ "Only a person who risks all that he cannot keep, to gain that which he can never lose, is truly free." Anonymous Poet

03-26-2005, 08:26 PM	#36
lookout123 changed his status to single Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Right behind you. No, the other side. Posts: 10,308	the problem is that stricter gun laws only keep guns out of the hands of people who follow the law. criminals aren't overly concerned about the laws. and as far as the number of school shooting you have? compare the number of kids you have in each schools times the number of schools you have to similar statistics in the US... see something a little obvious here? we have a lot more kids in a lot more schools so shootings will be more frequent here. but that is irrelevant, only comparing shootings per capita would be appropriate. __________________ Getting knocked down is no sin, it's not getting back up that's the sin

03-27-2005, 12:42 PM	#38
jaguar whig Join Date: Apr 2001 Posts: 5,075	Considering in the UK there have been numerous incidents and drive-bys with AK-47s and MAC-10s not to mention police raids picking up plastique, grenades, assult rifles and semi-auto pistols I don't think banning guns solves the problem. The situation is so bad in nottingham now that police are armed on patrol for the first time in the UK. Fix the social stuff and the rest will fix itself. __________________ Good friends, good books and a sleepy conscience: this is the ideal life. - Twain

03-23-2005, 06:41 PM	#31
warch lurkin old school Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Minnesota Posts: 2,796	The kid was sick, he lacked a net, he was living in isolation, he had access to weapons. I'm not quick to bag on the teachers 'cause they're in the firing range and most every teacher I know would tune in as close as possible and take a bullet for any kid in their care. The only thing I think that could have impacted this case positively would have been close psych treatment at a very young age. But he's moving from Mpls to living in a poor res community and easy to miss. I think its weird that he was a self described native nazi.

03-28-2005, 01:30 AM	#40
wolf lobber of scimitars Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Phila Burbs Posts: 20,774	Licenses are poised to become the national ID cards. I often wish I could do without, but I've observed the problems a friend who steadfastly won't have one has had. I also like driving too much. __________________ wolf eht htiw og "Conspiracies are the norm, not the exception." --G. Edward Griffin The Creature from Jekyll Island High Priestess of the Church of the Whale Penis

03-28-2005, 10:55 AM	#42
Troubleshooter The urban Jane Goodall Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Florida Posts: 3,012	Oh no! We can't put any restrictions on illegal aliens! What would that do to our trade and political negotiations with Mexico? The horror! __________________ I have gained this from philosophy: that I do without being commanded what others do only from fear of the law. - Aristotle

03-28-2005, 11:02 AM	#43
wolf lobber of scimitars Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Phila Burbs Posts: 20,774	I'll get back to you on that once I figure out what they have that we want ... Cheap whores ... weed ... brightly colored serapes and sombreros ... I'll think of it at some point. __________________ wolf eht htiw og "Conspiracies are the norm, not the exception." --G. Edward Griffin The Creature from Jekyll Island High Priestess of the Church of the Whale Penis

03-28-2005, 11:30 AM	#45
lookout123 changed his status to single Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Right behind you. No, the other side. Posts: 10,308	no, no - let tw continue to live in his carefully crafted world of overreaction, oversimplification, and bad analogies. it is for his own good. can you imagine a day when he wakes up to find that the world doesn't fit into this nice little cubby holes he has designed? Wolf will be getting a visit. __________________ Getting knocked down is no sin, it's not getting back up that's the sin

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