If Moore's Law hits a sinkhole...

[mbpark]

Hi.

I'm not little. I also don't talk about my customers here, as it's frowned upon by them. I also know several of the users here personally, including Undertoad. In my line of work, I work in the same crowd as tw, Undertoad, and a few other users.

I have never heard anything but respect for those people, and even their former business partners.

I don't talk buzzwords.

I don't brag or make comments about my customers.

I also do research, and know the difference between a website and a peer-reviewed journal. EETimes is peer-reviewed. Your sites are not. TW, when he presents research, presents it from those sources. Any corporate researcher or academic will tell you which one is the most proven.

I've been here since 1991. Deal with it. I don't need to justify my posting frequency to you.

And BTW, the last guy I met with your attitude got tossed out of a customer's site. People with the attitude you have shown do not last long in any organization. Unfortunately, I encounter too many of you in my travels. People with that personality give IT consultants a bad name.

When you attempt to make blind judgements based on my number of posts, then you have proven yourself to be a real troll.

Go away, little boy. We have had enough of you. Find somewhere else to brag about what you do.

[Radar]

My degree is in computer science engineering, which yes, includes chip design. I haven't actually designed chips or even used those skills since college years ago, because I went into networking. In either case, I am an engineer, and work with the latest and greatest technology whether it's communication satellites, or immunodiagnostic testing equipment. I always keep up on what's current, and what I said was correct. I provided references and he didn't.

Talking shit with nothing to back it up (like tw and dar) to someone who actually can back it up and who has offered references is an untenable position.

[dar512]

Originally Posted by Radar

Talking shit with nothing to back it up (like tw and dar) to someone who actually can back it up and who has offered references is an untenable position.

You're still blowing smoke, kid. I have not yet made a statement about Moore's law. I asked you to clarify one of your statments and I called you on your protestations of authority. So your statement is a bit premature.

I've also had a course in chip design and I suspect I've been in the computer industry longer than you. But I don't think that makes me an expert in this area and I don't think you are either.

[Undertoad]

On the subject of providing references, tw's first post referenced the front page of the Aug 15 EE Times. Nothing radar has posted is even on the topic of what tw originally posted from the EE Times.

And in fact everything he has posted (as tw noted) suggests that quantum computing is too far off to combat Moore's law slowdown. In fact the first meaningful link he posted on quantum computing notes, right in the summary,

This structure, based on years of work on single-electronics, is the first step in the development of a quantum computer based on conventional silicon technology.

The FIRST STEP after YEARS of work.

tw has provided a very meaningful reference that backs up his assertion. radar has posted semi-meaningful references that disprove his assertion.

That's my summary of the account so far but you all could re-read the thread and see for yourself.

[wolf]

I have a Bachellor's in Geography, but I do not call myself a Geographer.

I have a Master's in Clinical Psychology and do not call myself a Psychologist.

Having a degree in engineering does not make you an engineer, unless you have worked in that particular discipline for a significant amount of time.

Last we knew, Radar, you were going around to people's offices and making sure they couldn't play Minesweeper.

[Radar]

I have a Bachellor's in Geography, but I do not call myself a Geographer.

I have a Master's in Clinical Psychology and do not call myself a Psychologist.

What you call yourself is irrelevant. I suppose a person who graduates from medical school shouldn't call themselves a doctor too eh? The fact remains that if you have graduated in the coursework to become a doctor, you are one even if you choose not to use those skills. The same is true of all the other examples too.

Wolf, I also design, build, and support global computer networks consisting of different security models, wiring, topologies, network protocols, routing protocols, operating systems, hardware, software, databases, email systems, secure VPN's, etc.

I have never supported less than 800 people in any computer job since 1996.

I'm also not too proud to do any small job, especially when a vice-president requests it. So if they want me to boobytrap minesweeper, go to the house of the CEO to setup his wireless networking, unpack computers, do hardware fixes on old systems, or take a trip to Cabo, Mexico to setup 40 laptops, I do that too.

I provided meaningful and relevant references and facts backing up the assertion that Moore's law is in no danger of being violated because we'll have working quantum computers within 3 years. He gave worthless opinions backed by nothing.

[Undertoad]

Originally Posted by Radar

I provided meaningful and relevant references and facts backing up the assertion that Moore's law is in no danger of being violated because we'll have working quantum computers within 3 years.

http://cellar.org/calendar.php?do=ge...=2008-9-20&c=1

So noted in the Cellar calendar entry for September 20, 2008.

[wolf]

Originally Posted by Radar

I provided meaningful and relevant references and facts backing up the assertion that Moore's law is in no danger of being violated because we'll have working quantum computers within 3 years.

Originally Posted by Undertoad

http://cellar.org/calendar.php?do=ge...=2008-9-20&c=1

So noted in the Cellar calendar entry for September 20, 2008.

A swing and a miss?

[Clodfobble]

Awesome, UT! This is just like the "Book of Right" in my house. My family has a blank book where we write down all our argument-predictions, so we can tally long-term who's actually right. I want to see more dubious Dwellar claims placed on the calendar!

[glatt]

Most people are too smart/chicken to make predictions like that. I made a prediction earlier today in the hurricane thread that Rita won't be as bad as Katrina. I hope I'm right (especially for the victims' sake,) but that prediction might come back to haunt me.

[classicman]

But, but, but, I just ordered mine online.



Btw, Great thread.

[Undertoad]

When the entry was added, I didn't say anything (there is usually nothing to be gained by arguing with Radar directly), but it was pretty clear that Radar was putting all his eggs in one company's PR basket ("D-Wave") and that the company was releasing just enough information to attract venture capital, a sure sign that they are too optimistic.

That company has now run two closed demos which attracted much more criticism than money, in which they claim that QC was happening and roughly the rest of the QC community says it was not. The demos, which included solving a Sudoku puzzle (!), involved tasks that a non-QC can perform.

After the demos, the last of which happened in November 2007 - one pro-D-Wave blogger noted "I think that there’s a lot to be said for D-Wave, and a lot to be said against it, but by far they’ve got the best chances of anyone at making a quantum computer in the next 5 years." In the next expo where they show, they are involved in a talk which claims their disruptive technology, amongst others such as optical communication and flash memory, "could lead to viable systems in the 2015-2020 timeframe."

Too often Radar uses a "conclusion first" approach: decide what the truth is, and then seek out any corroborating evidence. *Any* evidence will do, no matter how suspect, because it reflects "truth". We all do this from time to time, particularly in politics. The process of picking a side is practically arbitrary, like picking a team to root for in a sport. Once the side is picked, though, the chosen side represents all that is good, and the opposition represents all that is evil or bad.

And so by post #6 in the thread we are already into ad hominem and claims that we are Engineers and Know What We Are Talking About. At that point the whole thread becomes the usual boring insult-trading, and only the Cellar calendar can rescue us.

[Elspode]

I'd like to make a prediction. You can put it on the calendar if you like, too, UT.

We will have a new POTUS by January 20, 2009.

I have based this projection on careful research and evaluation of all available information, and I am very confident that my conclusion is correct.

[xoxoxoBruce]

You underestimate the power of Cheney.

[mbpark]

UT/Tony,

I've been calling the Cellar in various forms since 1991, and I really appreciate what you've done here over the years transforming this from Waffle on UNIX to this current setup.

His grandstanding was the ONLY time I have been insulted the way I have been on your system in 17 years of calling/posting here.

I have his post to me saved. If I EVER am in a position where he is presented to me or an associate at another company as an IT consultant, I will forward that post to the consulting agency who presents me to him, along with a strong "will not hire - EVER" notice.

I am no "Little Boy" who knows nothing. I actually know two people working in this field who have Ph.D's from Stanford in the related physics disciplines, and who are establishing a business working on practical applications of quantum computing (Tony, you have access to my LinkedIn profile, one is there directly linked to me). This is years from production, even with DARPA money, HP money, and IBM money.

Like I said....he's an idiot. 17 years of intelligent dialogue with many cool users here who I know personally, and he has to come along with his grandstanding attitude, not knowing who he's pissing off (and assuming they're a little boy newbie who knows nothing), and insulting everyone who doesn't agree with his point of view.

Radar can go fuck himself with something that has lots of splinters and exposed jagged surfaces.

Mitch