AIG

[Shawnee123]

None of us are immune. I have a computer, television...but I don't buy into the "I must have everything" mantra. I used to be a rabid consumerist, then I realized most of the stuff doesn't matter, in the long run.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Kimberly-Clark spent $25,000,000, in its third quarter, on advertising to persuade Americans against trusting their bottoms to cheaper brands of toilet paper.

[Shawnee123]

The Dollar Store rocks!

I only buy the stuff with more actual paper to each roll.

[DanaC]

Advertising is just a method of informing the public of your product and trying to generate desire/demand. No different to shouting from a market stall.

[classicman]

Originally Posted by DanaC

Advertising is just a method of informing the public of your product and trying to generate desire/demand.

Thanks Dana for the one rational unemotionally charged post in all of this.

I wonder how we would know about the newest, most updated and perhaps SAFER environmentally friendly products around if we didn't have advertising. Perhaps we could all just watch and wait for FOX or MSNBC to tell us. Yeh, I'm sure Keith Olberman, Rachel Maddow &/or Bill O'Reilly are really looking out for anyone other than themselves or their agenda.

[sugarpop]

I didn't say we shouldn't have any advertising, I said I thought the industry should be reformed. And I stand by that.

Advertising is responsible for creating a nation of self-absorbed, insecure, seriously fucked up people who can't think for themselves. You really should read Adbusters sometime. Go to Barnes and Noble and sit and read one. It's a great magazine.

[DanaC]

Originally Posted by sugarpop

Advertising is responsible for creating a nation of self-absorbed, insecure, seriously fucked up people who can't think for themselves.

Yes. And a nation of self-absorbed, insecure, seriously fucked-up people who can't think for themselves is responsible for creating the advertising culture.

or maybe not. Because maybe America isn't a nation of self-absorbed, insecure, seriously fucked-up people who can't think for themselves. My God you have a bleak view of your society. Or perhaps you are apart from them? Do you not include yourself in that? Is it just everybody else who is fucked up and unable to think?

Sorry. That came across more aggressively than was my intent. But really, society is more than just a purchasing public.



@ Redux: I didn't argue against restraints ion advertising. I am all for advertising standards and governmental control in order to prevent people being conned outright. I just disagree with the idea that advertising is either the devil, or responsible for society's ills. It is indicative of many societal problems and concerns. It may well contribute to some very unsavoury aspects of our cultrure (such as gender constructions which sexualise girls at younger and younger ages). But that isn't advertising per se, it is how we use that tool, the desires which it draws on and propogates that contain the darkness.

[TGRR]

Originally Posted by DanaC

Because maybe America isn't a nation of self-absorbed, insecure, seriously fucked-up people who can't think for themselves.

[tw]

Originally Posted by DanaC

Yes. And a nation of self-absorbed, insecure, seriously fucked-up people who can't think for themselves is responsible for creating the advertising culture.

Not at all aggressive. Quite honest because you express it in a tone that makes your statement more honest.

Society did not change. Percentage of people who blindly believe only what they are told has been (should be) constant. What changed? We never had extremists inspiring the naive to believe half truths and sound bytes using the same techniques that Hitler used. We never had so many Rush Limbaughs promoting outright lies and myths. American radio now sounds similar to the Radio Moscow broadcasts I once listened to in the 1960s.

What has changed? America always had profitable companies such as Geritol, Luden's cough drops, and cigarettes promoted for health. What we now have are extremists (people who work for a political agenda) telling the naive that sound bytes alone make one a political and economic expert. That is what has changed. Look at how many still are so ignorant as to believe tax cuts create long term economic growth.

Once upon a time, Democrats and Republicans argued by day and drank together by night. Today, America has too many extremists and a shortage of centrists (the intelligent people). Difficult is for centrists (ie Specter of PA, Snow of Maine, etc) to have the influence that once dominated American politics. Made so difficult because so many so hate American as to listen to and believe the Rush Limbaugh types.

Once upon a time, those who did not learn before having an opinion need not aggressively express opinions. Today, soundbytes make the lesser educated Americans into experts. After all, Rush Limbaught told them; so it must be true. That is what has changed.

Originally Posted by DanaC

Advertising is just a method of informing the public of your product and trying to generate desire/demand. No different to shouting from a market stall.

i would suggest the intent of most advertising, from packaging/labeling to tv/print media, is to sell.

The role of government regulation of some advertising is to more fully inform the consumer.

Caveat emptor is fine and dandy, but not always possible.

If I want "all natural" beef, with no antibiotics or chemicals, government labeling (advertising) regulations provide a level of assurance beyond the manufacturer's word.

If I am considering medication, the regulatory requirement to list possible side effects (not only on the product, but in ads) provides additional information that the manufacturer might not otherwise make available.

[tw]

I was raised on advertising. Before the age of ten, I even recruited friends for TV commercials. One was featured on nationwide TV.

My father quit advertising when the FTC stepped in. They had to start telling the truth. It took all the fun out of it. Well, he was exaggerating. They simply had to not lie so blatantly.

Advertising is also what Limbaugh does. Because so many have opinions without first learning facts, then many (ie the most religious) will deny when facts and numbers finally arrive. That is Limbaugh's job. Tell the most naive how to think first. When reality appears, these most extremists will aggressively deny - even attack the messenger.

Need an example? See how ozone layer destruction was denied for so long. See discussions here in 2002 about Saddam's WMDs. Or see the few here some years ago who avvidly claimed Chevy is a good car even after facts and numbers said otherwise.

Why do many here use fluoride toothpaste? Or believe Pepto-Bismol’s pink coating relieves intestinal problems? I personally watched it all happen as a kid.

Childhood leukemia is traceable to electric power lines? Vitamin C averts common colds? Power strip protectors protect computers? All myths widely believed only because it was the first thing they were told. That is what advertising is all about. Get you to believe cigarette smoking is good for your health - so that many would later deny the Surgeon General's report. Advertising works because so many - a majority - believe the first thing they are told; don't first demand numbers and facts.

I was raised watching this happen – which is why I so often am a minority opposed to popular beliefs: ie Saddam’s WMDs, GM products, what MBAs do, the murder of seven Challenger and seven Columbia astronauts, etc.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Hey, don't be knocking Chevy because they don't make what you want, or what you have decided everyone else should drive whether they like it or not.:p

[tw]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

Hey, don't be knocking Chevy because they don't make what you want, or what you have decided everyone else should drive whether they like it or not.

A Chevy costs more to build than a comparable Mercedes. Chevy's higher manufacturing costs are directly traceable to crappy MBA designs. But then we who first demand numbers knew this even more than 10 years ago. One has to be completely ignorant to want a Chevy - for a long list of reasons including reliabilty, costs, and a desire to be unpatriotic.

Chevy even advertised itself: The heartattack of America. Then some spin doctor liar changed it to heartbeat.

[classicman]

Advertising is NOT responsible at all. If you are too stupid to know what you need or don't need thats on YOU, not the advertising industry.

[sugarpop]

Dana, there is a LOT that I don't like right now about my country. These are things that I have noticed getting worse for many years. I really do believe that advertising is partly responsible for some of the fucked up things I talk about. Is advertising the devil? Of course not, and I don't have a problem with companies advertising their products. But I am not blind to the problems that are caused by it either. And yes, I do think a majority of the people are as I described. Really though, it isn't their fault. They are asleep.

The thing is, we were warned about it back in the 60s, but we have allowed capitalism to morph into this nasty thing that we have today.