The Double-Standard Rant

[DanaC]

When me and Judah lived together, housework was a constant bone of contention. I eventually got sick of asking, nagging, pleading, sulking,making a joke of, asking nicely; none of which resulted in anything but the most desultary attempt on his part. He wold wash pots and they'd need washing again.....he would tidy up by shoving everything that was not on a shelf into the one creaking drawer.

I tried to play the "right, let's see how long it takes for him to get sick of the mess and never having any clean plates" trick.....I quietly went on strike. After a week and a half I couldn't take it any more and cleaned up. he didn't notice.

But.....when my eczema went crazy and my hands were cracked and sore,and any dust set my eyes streaming: he washed up, he hoovered and did the dusting etc. He still didn't spot when things needed doing, but if i started to do a task, he'd leap up and take over....or if I asked him he'd do it without arguing, just as soon as his programme had finished.

:P

What's really funny, is that now we are no longer living together, he has turned into a clean freak and I live in a mess :P

[limey]

I suppose what really irks me is that for any task that is regular but not daily (i.e. do some laundry, fill the coal hod or kindlers bucket) I have to ask. (Best Beloved does notice when he can fit nothing more in the bin and takes out the trash at that point.). If you can have "do the dishes" on a daily check list, why not "Check status of hod, bucket and laundry basket" too?
Is there really a biological difference which means that women notice that these things need doing and men don't?
And, in case you're wondering, I ask BB to do these things as politely as though we hadn't already agreed they are part of his responsibilities, and as though I hadn't already asked him to do it without me asking (i.e. no mind reading expected).

Originally Posted by limey

I suppose what really irks me is that for any task that is regular but not daily (i.e. do some laundry, fill the coal hod or kindlers bucket) I have to ask. (Best Beloved does notice when he can fit nothing more in the bin and takes out the trash at that point.). If you can have "do the dishes" on a daily check list, why not "Check status of hod, bucket and laundry basket" too?
Is there really a biological difference which means that women notice that these things need doing and men don't?
And, in case you're wondering, I ask BB to do these things as politely as though we hadn't already agreed they are part of his responsibilities, and as though I hadn't already asked him to do it without me asking (i.e. no mind reading expected).

Please don't take this as an accusation... just a question, nothing more (because many I have been around and with do this).
Do you go straight to griping about this or have you ever discussed this issue nicely without sounding pissed about it with em'?
Guys become defensive and will not "hear" what you say very well if you "tone" them.
My wife has learned this... I can be a dick when bitched at, I feel it is my right.
If one just states, calmly "When you don't/or do do this it really bothers me and this is why and how it makes me feel..." with no emotions evident while describing it.
Yes, I said no emotions... speak guy to him and he will understand. Tell him how you feel and what you want, not show him and you will get results.

Now, if you REALLY want to get results, look at yourself and everything and find something that you do/do not do that you know bugs the shit out of him (don't say it... you know there are several) and tell him that you will now adjust your behavior accordingly too because you want to start listening to him the way you are asking him to for you. This is my wife's secret weapon... it always gets my attention at the end of the conversation and closes the deal.
This conversation CANNOT take a long time... that is a long time in GUY TIME, that is ten min or so at the most... it should only take five or so and does not need to have lots of hand holding or tons of close, creepy eye-contact... just talk to him.
It works for us. But, my wife is very hip.
Remember... I am not saying you don't do this, have not tried it... just throwin' it out there for you or others, just-in-case.
Most of us try to talk to others the way we want to be spoken to... when talking to the opposite sex that is suicide.:p

[limey]

Originally Posted by rkzenrage

Please don't take this as an accusation... just a question, nothing more (because many I have been around and with do this).
Do you go straight to griping about this or have you ever discussed this issue nicely without sounding pissed about it with em'?
Guys become defensive and will not "hear" what you say very well if you "tone" them.
My wife has learned this... I can be a dick when bitched at, I feel it is my right.
If one just states, calmly "When you don't/or do do this it really bothers me and this is why and how it makes me feel..." with no emotions evident while describing it.
Yes, I said no emotions... speak guy to him and he will understand. Tell him how you feel and what you want, not show him and you will get results.

Now, if you REALLY want to get results, look at yourself and everything and find something that you do/do not do that you know bugs the shit out of him (don't say it... you know there are several) and tell him that you will now adjust your behavior accordingly too because you want to start listening to him the way you are asking him to for you. This is my wife's secret weapon... it always gets my attention at the end of the conversation and closes the deal.
This conversation CANNOT take a long time... that is a long time in GUY TIME, that is ten min or so at the most... it should only take five or so and does not need to have lots of hand holding or tons of close, creepy eye-contact... just talk to him.
It works for us. But, my wife is very hip.
Remember... I am not saying you don't do this, have not tried it... just throwin' it out there for you or others, just-in-case.
Most of us try to talk to others the way we want to be spoken to... when talking to the opposite sex that is suicide.:p

Thank you for the advice. I think I tend to always approach this the same way, which is to ask once a day for the task to be done, in a neutral way - I, too, don't want to appear to be a nag. Quite often this is as I leave for work (BB is out of work at present) - perhaps not the best time of day? The tasks are ones we have agreed on, not that I've arbitrarily assigned, and BB agrees happily to undertake the task - but then it doesn't get done. I will try the "When it doesn't happen it makes me feel ..." approach, and will look for adjustments I can make, too.

[Griff]

Originally Posted by limey

Thank you for the advice. I think I tend to always approach this the same way, which is to ask once a day for the task to be done, in a neutral way - I, too, don't want to appear to be a nag.

Maybe you guys need to be more explicit or even negotiate over who does which chores around the house and on what schedule? YMMV every relationship handles these things differently.

[yesman065]

Originally Posted by rkzenrage

This conversation CANNOT take a long time... that is a long time in GUY TIME, that is ten min or so at the most... it should only take five or so and does not need to have lots of hand holding or tons of close, creepy eye-contact... just talk to him.

This is so true, and in the grand scheme of things, very very funny. I felt my entire brain shut down when this happened. Suddenly, she is done talking and I have heard absolutely nothing. Its like I blacked out.

[SteveDallas]

I submit that the seat falling down in midstream (as it were) is not a desirable outcome, whether or not actual injury occurs.

[DanaC]

I think an important factor to bear in mind here, is that as human beings, we all have the capacity to be unreasonable at times. Not every case of an otherwise lovely partner not doing the thing that will make life easier/happier or fairer for their spouse is because the spouse didn't ask in the best way. Sometimes that partner is just not being reasonable. Likewise not everything a spouse tackles with their partner is tackled appropriately and reasonably. We all at times operate to a doublestandard: it comes from having an individual perspective on the world. One can instantly see what one percieves to fair in regards one's own situation, but may not instantly percieve what's fair or not for someone else.

[Clodfobble]

Originally Posted by Stormieweather

The toilet seat stays down, by the way (babies have drowned in toilets, you know?!).

I personally know someone whose 2-year-old drowned in a toilet. Just leaned over to touch the shiny water and lost her balance. She was literally only out of her mother's sight for about 30 seconds, but it was long enough. The lid stays down, always.

My wife is a bit messy, it used to be a real problem for us... I had to decide, so I did. I hate it, but I love her.
& she does not see it... it is creepy.

[yesman065]

Great choice rz - thats awesome of you! Many people let the petty shit erode a relationship and for you to overlook that which really bothers you for the sake of your love is a testament to your commitment. She's a lucky gal!

I'm not all that great... I'm not above moving her stuff around sometimes just to watch her search for it when it gets to me.
The evil part is that I put it where it is supposed to be, and she never looks there.

[Iggy]

Since I do most of the cleaning if my SO can't find something he always asks me. Nine times out of ten I can tell him either where it is or where to look for it (i.e. I will tell him it is either on the kitchen table or on the desk).

[suncrafter]

LOL! Good rant.

Originally Posted by DanaC

I think an important factor to bear in mind here, is that as human beings, we all have the capacity to be unreasonable at times. Not every case of an otherwise lovely partner not doing the thing that will make life easier/happier or fairer for their spouse is because the spouse didn't ask in the best way. Sometimes that partner is just not being reasonable. Likewise not everything a spouse tackles with their partner is tackled appropriately and reasonably. We all at times operate to a doublestandard: it comes from having an individual perspective on the world. One can instantly see what one percieves to fair in regards one's own situation, but may not instantly percieve what's fair or not for someone else.

However, when called on it, shown it... time to own it.

WTF is the deal with accepting compliments from total strangers, acting like they are manna from heaven, and treating mine like lies from the lips of a demon?! When I got pissed about this, she got upset... I'm a bad person for being pissed because she is upset because I'm a liar, but not really.. WTF!!!
Wimmin' are fucking crazy!

See... I done figured it all out.