Iraq by the Numbers - or how to be dumb. - Page 6

Urbane Guerrilla · 01-27-2007, 03:02 AM

HM, it seems to me you mistake their fault -- their eighteen-year effort to start a war with us, dating from Marine Barracks Beirut 1983 through 9/11 -- for our fault. I don't.

Happy Monkey · 01-27-2007, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urbane Guerrilla

HM, it seems to me you mistake their fault -- their eighteen-year effort to start a war with us, dating from Marine Barracks Beirut 1983 through 9/11 -- for our fault. I don't.

Who are you talking about here?

Griff · 01-29-2007, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urbane Guerrilla

HM, it seems to me you mistake their fault -- their eighteen-year effort to start a war with us, dating from Marine Barracks Beirut 1983 through 9/11 -- for our fault. I don't.

Hmmm... so you're saying our problems with the Arab world began in '83 in Beirut? Do you think those Marines were there on vacation?

Urbane Guerrilla · 01-27-2007, 03:07 AM

"...of course their allies" -- in a word, you, Ali.

Keep in mind our self-made, self-declared enemies are busy trying to bully us. We see no practical difference between this and the assaults against us that put us into World War Two. Still gonna mean fightin', and we understand that.

Fighting of this nature mostly quits once everybody is too fucking tired of it. But you have to wear everybody out first.

Aliantha · 01-27-2007, 10:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urbane Guerrilla

"...of course their allies" -- in a word, you, Ali.

No shit sherlock! Glad you picked that part up UG

Keep in mind our self-made, self-declared enemies are busy trying to bully us. We see no practical difference between this and the assaults against us that put us into World War Two. Still gonna mean fightin', and we understand that.

The US didn't get involved in WW11 till the Japs bombed the shit out of you. I'm sure knee jerk was good then, and I'm sure it's got a lot to do with all these 'pre-emptive' strikes now.

Fighting of this nature mostly quits once everybody is too fucking tired of it. But you have to wear everybody out first.

Fighting of this nature doesn't stop till the citizens of one country or another stand up and say enough is enough (you dumb shits). Why did the war in Vietnam end? Do you remember?

Urbane Guerrilla · 02-02-2007, 12:40 AM

Happy Monkey, your reply shows doublethink, or maybe unthink, if you cannot follow my argument. Who, indeed. Doubleplusungood.

Griff, no, I'm not saying that; I'm saying the current phase of the problem, the going after us, really got going about then. Were they or were they not trying to either start a war with us, or win it then?

Aliantha, I remember it ended when the Communists won in 1975 -- and then kept the place buggered up, and the refugees streaming and rafting out of there, for the next ten years. One reason I'm ardently pro-human and anticommunist, remember?

Really, people: I'm far more sensible than you want me to be; deal with it better than you have, okay?

xoxoxoBruce · 02-02-2007, 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Griff

Hmmm... so you're saying our problems with the Arab world began in '83 in Beirut? Do you think those Marines were there on vacation?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urbane Guerrilla

Griff, no, I'm not saying that; I'm saying the current phase of the problem, the going after us, really got going about then. Were they or were they not trying to either start a war with us, or win it then?

They were not. They were trying to get the US out of their yard..... and still are.

Aliantha · 02-02-2007, 01:08 AM

Your view on how and why the Vietnam 'occupation' ended is as warped as some of your other views UG.

I rather think it was because public pressure led to the government of the day deciding they'd bitten off more than they could chew and couldn't solve the problems of another nation any better than those of their own.

Urbane Guerrilla · 02-02-2007, 11:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aliantha

Your view on how and why the Vietnam 'occupation' ended is as warped as some of your other views UG.

Which amounts to a confirmation that I'm really in pretty good shape, and arrow-straight.

Quote:

I rather think it was because public pressure led to the government of the day deciding they'd bitten off more than they could chew and couldn't solve the problems of another nation any better than those of their own.

Which amounts to making an excuse for a most horrendous betrayal to the forces of oppression and injustice. Communism's class-war paradigm creates both, on an industrial scale, everywhere it's been. Remember that in 1954-55 the refugees ran from Communism from the North to the South. Were they wrong? History says they were absolutely right.

Thus, kill communists faster than they can be made, and injustice and one source of oppression is removed from our Earth. This is a good thing. Bloody way to get it, but human goodness and resistance to evil is worth any volume of blood. I've been there, examined it, and that's my conclusion.

You may of course think as you like -- but that doesn't mean your opinion would actually coincide with the reality. I endeavor to keep my opinions grounded in reality and in large measure I succeed.

North Vietnam conquered South Vietnam motivated by and in the name of communism -- nationalism was never more than a convenient cloak. In the end, the Vietnamese had to abandon communism in order to restore the nation to functionality. Marxism's approach to economics doesn't much coincide with how economics really works, and without a good economy, nothing works and life is terrible. Collectivism doesn't work and shouldn't be practiced. Shoot its practitioners before they get around to shooting you, which they will do if you have anything of mankind's true birthright in your mental makeup -- your liberty.

tw · 02-03-2007, 06:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urbane Guerrilla

Remember that in 1954-55 the refugees ran from Communism from the North to the South.

Wow. I did not know that refugees were fleeing the north and south pole. Having learned that, even I can be arrow-straight.

Amazing how history is so easily understood once it is rewritten.

Griff · 02-03-2007, 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urbane Guerrilla

In the end, the Vietnamese had to abandon communism in order to restore the nation to functionality. Marxism's approach to economics doesn't much coincide with how economics really works, and without a good economy, nothing works and life is terrible. Collectivism doesn't work and shouldn't be practiced.

You got this much right but you fail at being an anti-totalitarian by placing too little faith in a free market to leverage those other freedoms.

02-02-2007, 01:43 AM

That we were getting our ass kicked due to our policies toward how we fought that "conflict" had nothing to do with it? Yeah, right.

Aliantha · 02-02-2007, 01:51 AM

those tricksy jungle folk did make life hard didn't they?

Aliantha · 02-02-2007, 01:52 AM

Maybe Bush thinks it'll be different this time cause there's no trees to hide behind?

piercehawkeye45 · 02-02-2007, 01:59 AM

Or maybe because there is no way to stop the Iraqi civil war.

01-27-2007, 03:02 AM	#1
Urbane Guerrilla Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Southern California Posts: 6,674	HM, it seems to me you mistake their fault -- their eighteen-year effort to start a war with us, dating from Marine Barracks Beirut 1983 through 9/11 -- for our fault. I don't. __________________ Wanna stop school shootings? End Gun-Free Zones, of course.

01-27-2007, 03:07 AM	#4
Urbane Guerrilla Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Southern California Posts: 6,674	"...of course their allies" -- in a word, you, Ali. Keep in mind our self-made, self-declared enemies are busy trying to bully us. We see no practical difference between this and the assaults against us that put us into World War Two. Still gonna mean fightin', and we understand that. Fighting of this nature mostly quits once everybody is too fucking tired of it. But you have to wear everybody out first. __________________ Wanna stop school shootings? End Gun-Free Zones, of course.

02-02-2007, 12:40 AM	#6
Urbane Guerrilla Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Southern California Posts: 6,674	Happy Monkey, your reply shows doublethink, or maybe unthink, if you cannot follow my argument. Who, indeed. Doubleplusungood. Griff, no, I'm not saying that; I'm saying the current phase of the problem, the going after us, really got going about then. Were they or were they not trying to either start a war with us, or win it then? Aliantha, I remember it ended when the Communists won in 1975 -- and then kept the place buggered up, and the refugees streaming and rafting out of there, for the next ten years. One reason I'm ardently pro-human and anticommunist, remember? Really, people: I'm far more sensible than you want me to be; deal with it better than you have, okay? __________________ Wanna stop school shootings? End Gun-Free Zones, of course. Last edited by Urbane Guerrilla; 02-02-2007 at 12:48 AM.

02-02-2007, 01:08 AM	#8
Aliantha trying hard to be a better person Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 16,493	Your view on how and why the Vietnam 'occupation' ended is as warped as some of your other views UG. I rather think it was because public pressure led to the government of the day deciding they'd bitten off more than they could chew and couldn't solve the problems of another nation any better than those of their own. __________________ Kind words are the music of the world. F. W. Faber

02-02-2007, 01:51 AM	#13
Aliantha trying hard to be a better person Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 16,493	those tricksy jungle folk did make life hard didn't they? __________________ Kind words are the music of the world. F. W. Faber

02-02-2007, 01:43 AM	#12
rkzenrage Guest Posts: n/a	That we were getting our ass kicked due to our policies toward how we fought that "conflict" had nothing to do with it? Yeah, right.

02-02-2007, 01:52 AM	#14
Aliantha trying hard to be a better person Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 16,493	Maybe Bush thinks it'll be different this time cause there's no trees to hide behind? __________________ Kind words are the music of the world. F. W. Faber

02-02-2007, 01:59 AM	#15
piercehawkeye45 Franklin Pierce Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,695	Or maybe because there is no way to stop the Iraqi civil war.

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