Does Anyone feel like Bailing

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by Redux

I understand completely.

You live in a black and white world when it comes to anything this administration does.

Either it has to be 100% perfect or it is a failure.

Try applying that same standard to your own lives....which might explain why you (Merc) are so bitter and angry.

For example? Please describe what you understand about my life and what makes me bitter and angry?

[classicman]

My "agenda" if there is one, is to note the waste and abuse of my tax dollars and those of my children's and at this point THEIR children's. Obama doesn't need any more cheerleaders. If you expect me to rah rah all day, you will certainly be sadly mistaken.
However, if and when I find abuse or something that seems as though it is a waste, I will certainly bring it up for dissection and discussion.

You questions - lets see.

Will that agreement to build a turbine facility in the US have come about w/o the stimulus first?

How the hell would I know? A guess, probably not. Congress has apparently been too busy focused on healthcare to do much of anything else.

Will this new facility help make the US more competitive or at least become the manufacturing source for turbines on other US wind projects in the future? I would hope so but I dont know? Do you?

Same answer as your first question. Would the 1.4 BILLION be better spent going towards that same goal? Being spent here in America or sent to China. I can't see how it wouldn't.

Now its your turn to answer mine from post #1117 and give detailed info on the "team" from your link in post #1116.

Originally Posted by classicman

My "agenda" if there is one, is to note the waste and abuse of my tax dollars and those of my children's and at this point THEIR children's. Obama doesn't need any more cheerleaders. If you expect me to rah rah all day, you will certainly be sadly mistaken.
However, if and when I find abuse or something that seems as though it is a waste, I will certainly bring it up for dissection and discussion.

You questions - lets see.

How the hell would I know? A guess, probably not. Congress has apparently been too busy focused on healthcare to do much of anything else.

Same answer as your first question. Would the 1.4 BILLION be better spent going towards that same goal? Being spent here in America or sent to China. I can't see how it wouldn't.

Now its your turn to answer mine from post #1117 and give detailed info on the "team" from your link in post #1116.

You made my point....you're a black and white kinda guy....looking for the easy answers...and its not that easy.

And dont give me that crap that your noble agenda is looking after the taxpayers money. I care just as much about the economy and the country. I just try to look from a more comprehensive perspective.

Your question? So the company in question has Washington experience? Nothing new.

You want to focus on the negatives rather than the positives and find failure in every Obama program...have at it, dude.

I look for the good and understand and accept that it wont be perfect, but am comfortable with the outcome as long as the good is much greater than the bad.
'
And, IMO, and the opinion of many economists, the stimulus program has been good for the economy. You dont agree with me and those economists....fine.....but dont suggest that your shallow black and white approach to thinking is better.

As to respect...from one who asks for my help privately on one occasion and my understanding of issues on another occasion and then mocks my sources and attacks me publicly? That is respect? Take it somewhere else, dude.

[classicman]

What a cop-out. You again avoided the questions, attacked the poster and then try to discuss respect?

What is this "Washington experience" you mentioned? Please elaborate. I don't want to, how did you put it,

If one stops inquiring after reading just one article/opinion column...is it by design because it fits one's agenda or laziness and a preference for looking at issues as black or white and never considering shades of gray?

. . .seems like that shoe is on your foot.

Originally Posted by classicman

What a cop-out. You again avoided the questions, attacked the poster and then try to discuss respect?

Right back at you.....yes, I mean you, fucking hypocrite.

Originally Posted by classicman

What is this "Washington experience" you mentioned? Please elaborate. I don't want to, how did you put it,

I got a $500,000 grant from the GHW Bush DoJ when I worked at the NCPC. Does that make it a political payoff or make me a Bush supporter?

Shallow thinking again, dude...or just ignorant.

[classicman]

sorry I edited my post while you were insulting me.

Originally Posted by classicman

sorry I edited my post while you were insulting me.

facts...you ask me for help privately and insult me publicly. should I post the PMs?

[classicman]

Well that would be unfortunate, but you do what you gotta do. For what its worth, the P in PM stands for private. I never denied asking if you had any links for a kid who was writing a paper for a school project. Nor do I know why that has become applicable here. Trust me, it will be the last PM you ever get from me. Knowing now that you cannot be trusted to keep something private.

Originally Posted by classicman

Well that would be unfortunate, but you do what you gotta do. For what its worth, the P in PM stands for private.

Private? Sorta like videotaping private conservations (with leading questions) at ACORN offices that you had no problem with being exposed publicly?

Hypocrite?

[classicman]

While trying to stay on topic, here is what I found about this group.

Cappy McGarr - Began his career at Goldman, Sachs & Co
He runs McGarr Capital Holdings. He's a big-time donor to the Democratic Party.
Link
Link

Cappy R. McGarr campaign contributions:
(Donations of $3,000 or more during 2007-2008 cycle)
Obama for America - $8,000 on 6/24/2008
Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee - $10,000 on 6/28/2007
Great Plains Leadership Fund - $5,000 on 3/2/2007
Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee - $10,000 on 3/27/2008
Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee - $10,000 on 10/31/2007
Democratic National Committee - $10,000 on 9/27/2007
Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee - $5,000 on 4/17/2008
Contributions to political organizations (other than PACs or campaigns):
Barack Obama inauguration - $50,000
09/24/2008 Committee for Change $28,500

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Ed Cunningham - serving as a member of President Barack Obama’s National Finance Committee, the Presidential Advisory Committee (Technology), the U.S. Foreign Affairs Budget Project Advisory Committee, the American Academy of Diplomacy (Co-Director of International Negotiations Program), the Democratic National Committee National Advisory Committee, a U.S. Senate Candidate and a City Councilman.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Moses Boyd -
2010 Democratic Political Donations 12/$43,100
2008 Democratic Political Donations 20/$24,850
Combined total 10 years prior - - - - - - $1,500

ISG Government Relations Consultants -
Washington Lobbying and Government Relations Firm

G. John O'Hanlon — ISG Washington, D.C.
Moses Boyd — ISG Washington, D.C.
Adam S. Olsen — ISG Washington, D.C.
Brian Murphy — ISG Washington, D.C.
Mychal S. Boyd — ISG Washington, D.C.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

G. John O’Hanlon
Co-founded The Washing Group. Mr. O’Hanlon was a hands-on manager of this well-known Washington, D.C. lobbying firm. Board member of the Democratic National Committee’s Jefferson Trust, Trustee for the Kerry/DNC for President Campaign and has remained active with the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee
Also affiliated with the lobbying firm - Clark & Weinstock who states

We work hard to introduce clients to key policy makers, helping clients build their reputation, and become a well-known and trusted resource among the most important policy makers - impacting public policy outcomes.

Like maybe getting a 2 billion dollar deal to your own company perhaps?
Clients include - Goldman Sachs, Federal Home Loan Mortgage (Freddie Mac), Health Net Federal Services, Health Net, Inc., Capital Blue Cross... Link
One could spend hours documenting the affiliations of these people within the current administration. Everything I have seen proves to me that these people are Democratic lobbyists, insiders and campaign donors who are abusing the system and the stimulus program for their own personal gain.
Perhaps you know some of these people, Redux? Perhaps you are one of them? Why do you so hate America as to not say anything about this? Why are you not outraged?

So the stimulus program is a failure because in one (or even a few) documented cases, "friends" got grants!

Even if the grant leveraged the construction of a new facility to expand US wind tunnel technology to make the US more competitive in the long term....it sucks!

You obviously think this particular project should be canceled. I dont think it is that black and white or that simple..if it would risk losing a huge $billion investment in wind turbine technology for the US.

A couple of questionable smelling apples in the barrel and in your judgment, the whole barrel stinks.

And the earlier outrage in your "taxpayers" crusade...the turkey breasts and the cops grants that created jobs and provided services.....were a fucking joke.

It doesnt a change a damn thing about your cheap and cowardly and hypocritical tactics of criticizing me repeatedly publicly on policy sources after asking for my advice privately for such "biased" sources. You certainly didnt complain about the "bias" when you needed it.

For the record, that is what pissed me off.

Respect? You lost it with that (and evidently, not just from me) and I'll criticize posts that I think are shallow and ideological and keep calling you out.

[Spexxvet]

Originally Posted by Madman

I try not to get into political conversations. No point. After all - it's those damn liberals fault anyway.

They did create sin and everything else that's bad.

Without us Liberals, there'd be no fun at all.

[classicman]

Originally Posted by Redux

So the stimulus program is a failure because in one (or even a few) documented cases, "friends" got grants!

Is that an admission? finally.

You obviously think this particular project should be canceled.

False - I simply want the money going to American companies not China.

I dont think it is that black and white or that simple..if it would risk losing a huge $billion investment in wind turbine technology for the US.

CHINA is getting the $1.4 BILLION
America is only getting $600million
That disparity is my issue.

It doesnt a change a damn thing about your cheap and cowardly and hypocritical tactics of criticizing me repeatedly publicly on policy sources after asking for my advice privately for such "biased" sources. You certainly didn't complain about the "bias" when you needed it.

Insult, insult, insult and then the PM again - look either post it or shut up about it.

Respect? You lost it with that (and evidently, not just from me)

Oh well. Trust me no tears will be shed on my end.

Originally Posted by classicman

CHINA is getting the $1.4 BILLION
America is only getting $600million
That disparity is my issue.

You have a source link (not AU/ABC) that China is getting $1.4 billion? You accept it as factual because an AU/ABC report said so..even though it is not what the report even said?

You should be able to provide the grant award docs if they exist....unless you think official award documents are biased like the DoAg doc.

A Chinese company is getting that .4 billion for the West Texas project and as a result, it will leverage more than $1 billion to build a new wind turbine facility in the US that will result in long-term jobs and making the US more competitive.

Where is that other $1 billion to China? It may exist, but I cant find it.

In the West Texas project, the grant is exporting jobs to a Chinese company for one project, on a one-time basis, to supply the turbines. I agree that is bad.

And in return the Chinese company is exporting the wind turbine technology to a US company as well as funding to build a facility in the US to manufacture the turbines in the future that will provide more jobs on more projects in the US and make the US more competitive. I think that is very good.

IMO, the very good outweighs the bad and the US is getting the better end of the deal in the long term.