"Shoes Fly, Don't Bother Me" soundtrack to Bush's (R) latest visit to Iraq

I am not now, nor have I ever been, a member of the communist party!

[DanaC]

Damn...I have...


Actually, I haven't. But I was in the Socialist Workers Party.

[classicman]

You guys have it, me anyway, all wrong.

Originally Posted by classicman

You guys have it, me anyway, all wrong.

I am still trying to figure out how suggesting that we try understand that there may be resentment in Iraq against the US, in part, because of the horrific way a few of our troops treated Iraqi civilians, can draw a conclusion from you that:

"(my)opinion of the US soldier is as shitty and INCORRECT as theirs."

when I made it clear that it was not my opinon....it was suggestion that we try to understand their opinion

followed by the emotional:

"Well here is a hearty FUCK YOU to you!

"....will criticize and degrade the mean and women of our armed services????"

Who did I degrade other than the few specifically refered to as convicted or raping and murdering Iraqi women and abusing Iraqi prisonsers.

You got some 'splainin to do, dude or I would suggest the reaction to your post was appropriate.

[classicman]

Redux - I read your post as written not as you meant it. I thought we covered that in the explanation you gave previously. I apologize for what I "said" publicly. I thought - well you already know what I thought. - ANYWAY....

Dana, When it comes to "sex with children" and the attitude that "positive childhood sexual experiences with adults do occur" You are correct, I am not interested.

When it comes to other cultural beliefs, attitudes and political systems... that is a whole different discussion. If I wasn't interested in other thoughts or ideals or the discussion of these, why the hell would I be here on such a liberal-slanted site? Since you don't get it, I'll tell you - I realize that I am in the minority here with respect to my political views. One very important reason that I am here is to listen to, read, share and exchange differing views. Sheesh! You are such a manc tart!

[DanaC]

Originally Posted by classicman

Sheesh! You are such a manc tart!

True dat :P

Classic...thank you for your response.

Now I would like to know if you think it matters how citizens of other countries perceive the US as a nation and the president as a world leader?

While it is not the primary role of the president to play to the world stage and world public opinion, IMO, the perception is important and impacts us at every level....from anti-terrorism efforts to trade negotiations to tourism to the perception of US troops stationed around the world.

Look at a recent Pew poll on global attitudes about the US (and please dont go for the Merc cop-out on polls).

I would hope the results would give you pause for thought:

The image of the United States has improved markedly in most parts of the world, reflecting global confidence in Barack Obama. In many countries opinions of the United States are now about as positive as they were at the beginning of the decade before George W. Bush took office. Improvements in the U.S. image have been most pronounced in Western Europe, where favorable ratings for both the nation and the American people have soared....

....Signs of improvement in views of America are seen even in some predominantly Muslim countries that held overwhelmingly negative views of the United States in the Bush years. The most notable increase occurred in Indonesia, where people are well aware of Obama's family ties to the country and where favorable ratings of the U.S. nearly doubled this year.

However for the most part, opinions of the U.S. among Muslims in the Middle East remain largely unfavorable, despite some positive movement in the numbers in Jordan and Egypt. Animosity toward the U.S., however, continues to run deep and unabated in Turkey, the Palestinian territories and Pakistan.

http://pewresearch.org/pubs/1289/glo...-america-image

Even more striking is the perception and confidence of the US president as a world leader:

Does it matter to you what others outside the US think about us?

Could it be that these drastically more positive perceptions just might be in the US best interest..without compromising our own national interests in any way? Particularly in the regions of the world where we might face the greatest threat.

Beyond the general perceptions, look at it from the perspective of another discussion here, in terms of Iran (even though Iran is not included in the poll). Some dont see the value of one last attempt to negotiate with Iran and I assume would prefer a more belligerent US position. Is that more in our interest?

When did it become a bad thing to being liked AND respected beyond our own borders?

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by Redux

Now I would like to know if you think it matters how citizens of other countries perceive the US as a nation and the president as a world leader?

Not one fucking bit.

Look at a recent Pew poll on global attitudes about the US

Oh Look everybody, a Poll!!!!

Even more striking is the perception and confidence of the US president as a world leader:

Who frigging cares?

Does it matter to you what others outside the US think about us?

Absolutely not. It is not important.

When did it become a bad thing to being liked AND respected beyond our own borders?

Never. But when it becomes so important that you worry about what others think you have lost perspective about what is important for your own country and others that you were elected to represent. And anyone who forms policy on what others think is a total idiot. Obama, can you hear us?

[ZenGum]

Originally Posted by Redux
Now I would like to know if you think it matters how citizens of other countries perceive the US as a nation and the president as a world leader?

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

Not one fucking bit.

Cool. [Withdraws troops from Afghanistan]

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by ZenGum

Cool. [Withdraws troops from Afghanistan]

Yea, I have made my feelings about that situation known.

I honestly though we could get past the personal attacks.

Obviously not.

[jinx]

Bullshit. Own your words.

Hey...if thats how you feel, fine!

[TheMercenary]

Well imagine that...

[Urbane Guerrilla]

My dear boy, you can't convince me there was ever such a thing as a failed neocon policy. The greater part of their policy ideas weren't even tried, and the few that were had a fair measure of success. GWB was never considered one of their own by the neos. Do some more objective reading.

Looks like this is the thread I should put my demolition of your ignorant assertion that connecting gun control to genocide is somehow bizarre. Good enough.