More Lack of Separation... Just Sad

[Ibby]

“Because Jesus Christ is my Lord and Savior, I will speak out for him,” said the Rev. Jerry Fike of Mount Olivet Brethren Church, who gave the prayer at Samantha’s graduation. “The Bible encourages that.” Mr. Fike continued: “Ultimately, he is the one I have to please. If doing that places me at odds with the law of the land, I still have to follow him.”

And some people claim that fundamentalists aren't a threat to the security of our nation...

Has anyone here read Under The Banner Of Heaven? It's a very good read about Mormon fundamentalism, and for part of the book focuses on the story of the Lafferty brothers, who killed a 2-month old baby and her mother because 'God told them to'. Their justification? Almost exactly the words Rev. Fike used.

[Spexxvet]

Nice folks, those.

[BigV]

I am "counting to ten" in advance of a more considered response to this thread.

I might have to make a few repetitions...

[xoxoxoBruce]

Seriously, Big V?

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by rkzenrage

This is just wrong... NO RELIGION sponsored by ANY GOVERNMENT function. It ain't hard!

Families Challenging Religious Influence in Delaware Schools

GEORGETOWN, Del. ~big snip

Delaware? Hmmm..nothing ever changes but the date.

Delaware; Article 22 (1776) "Every person who shall be chosen a member of either house, or appointed to any office or place of trust...shall...also make and subscribe the following declaration, to whit:
'I,_____, do profess faith in God the Father, and in Jesus Christ His only Son, and in the Holy Ghost, one God, blessed for evermore; and I do acknowledge the holy scriptures of the Old and New Testament to be given by divine inspiration'"

Delaware; Article VIII, Section 9 (1792) "...No clergyman or preacher of the gospel, of any denomination, shall be capable of holding any civil office in this State, or of being a member of either branch of the legislature, while he continues in the exercise of the pastoral or clerical functions."

[BigV]

Yes, sir. I am. I find this whole subject of the conflation of religion and government very serious and the direction of our own country's events frightening. Plus you know me well enough to be unsurprised that I strive to think before speaking.

Updates.

Religious Right Leader Dobson's Campaign To Build Church-Based Political MachineDrive To Politicize Evangelical Pulpits During Fall Elections Jeopardizes Church Tax Exemptions, Warns AU’S Lynn

Religious Right leader James Dobson’s drive to build a church-based political machine will jeopardize the tax exemption of participating congregations, warns Americans United for Separation of Church and State.

In a recent e-mail alert to supporters, Dobson’s Focus on the Family (FOF) said it will work with eight state affiliates to mobilize evangelical Christian voters before the November elections. States targeted include Pennsylvania, Maryland, Michigan, Ohio, New Jersey, Minnesota, Montana and Tennessee.

The Dobson campaign has all the trappings of a traditional political machine. FOF’s state affiliates plan to name coordinators for each county who will supervise church coordinators in each evangelical congregation. FOF’s church coordinators will prod pastors to speak about political issues, conduct voter-registration drives and disseminate “voter guides and get-out-the-vote efforts.”

The Rev. Barry W. Lynn, Americans United executive director, says houses of worship should reject Dobson’s scheme.

“This is a blatant effort by Dobson to build a partisan political machine based in churches,” said Lynn. “He has made it abundantly clear that electing Republicans is an integral part of his agenda, and he doesn’t mind risking the tax exemption of churches in the process. Dobson wants to be a major political boss, and this is his way to get there.

“Congregations should not fall prey to Dobson’s shameless partisan schemes,” Lynn continued. “The Internal Revenue Service has promised swift and sure enforcement of federal tax law this year, and pastors should be aware of the danger to their churches’ tax exemption.”

Lynn noted that the IRS has ramped up its efforts to ensure that nonprofits, including houses of worship, abide by federal tax law, which prohibits all nonprofits from endorsing or opposing candidates for public office.

IRS Tax Commissioner Mark W. Everson has delivered two major speeches this year putting nonprofits on notice that the agency has heightened its scrutiny of their actions surrounding the 2006 elections. Everson’s speeches followed a report by the agency showing that many of the nonprofits being investigated for violations during the last election cycle are churches.


Americans United Condemns House Committee Passage Of Bill Cutting Off Attorneys' Fees In Church-State Cases

Click Here To Take Action Now

This morning the House Judiciary Committee approved a bill that would deter Americans from defending their religious rights in court. The so-called “Public Expression of Religion Act” (H.R. 2679) is now headed to the House floor for a full vote. Similar legislation (S. 3696) is also pending in the Senate. These bills would deny attorneys’ fees and out-of-pocket costs in cases won by advocates of church-state separation. The measure would make it much more difficult for citizens to challenge government-backed religious activities.

These bills are extreme and unwise proposals that will keep Americans from turning to the federal courts to protect their fundamental constitutional rights to worship freely. Members of Congress should stand up for the Bill of Rights, instead of undermining it with this harmful legislation — please send a message now.



PRESS RELEASE ** PRESS RELEASE ** PRESS RELEASE

Americans United Condemns House Committee Passage Of Bill Cutting Off Attorneys' Fees In Church-State Cases

Measure Is More Pandering To The Religious Right, Says AU’s Lynn

Americans United for Separation of Church and State today blasted the House Judiciary Committee’s approval of a bill that would make it more difficult for Americans to challenge church-state violations in court.

The so-called “Public Expression of Religion Act” targets those who stand up to church-state infringements by government officials. The measure, H.R. 2679, denies legal fees and out-of-pocket expenses to plaintiffs who win lawsuits under the First Amendment’s Establishment Clause, which bans the government from promoting religion.

The committee passed the bill on a voice vote today, and it is now headed to the House floor.

“It’s remarkable to me that at a time when our country faces so many serious issues, the Judiciary Committee has nothing better to do than pander to the Religious Right with this mean-spirited bill,” said the Rev. Barry W. Lynn, executive director of Americans United. “It’s another sad example of how this ‘do-nothing Congress’ earned its name.”

Lynn charged that the bill erodes individual rights. Under current law, Americans whose church-state rights have been violated by the government are free to file lawsuits. If the lawsuits are successful, the law allows for the recovery of reasonable attorneys’ fees and out-of-pocket expenses from the government. If H.R. 2679 were to become law, however, that will no longer be the case.

The measure is being touted by Religious Right groups as a way to discourage lawsuits challenging religious displays on public property. But, in fact, it is much broader than that and would deny reimbursement in conflicts ranging from government-sponsored religion in public schools to taxpayer funding for religious schools and other ministries.

Lynn said if the bill passes, it will set a precedent for Congress to deny attorneys’ fees in other types of litigation. Currently, attorneys’ fees are recoverable in a wide range of successful cases against the government involving constitutional and civil rights violations.

“This bill is nothing more than an attempt to scare people away from having their day in court,” Lynn said. “The House Judiciary Committee should be ashamed of itself for passing such a blatantly un-American scheme.”

Several national organizations that support civil rights and civil liberties have joined forces to oppose the measure.

Americans United is a religious liberty watchdog group based in Washington, D.C. Founded in 1947, the organization educates Americans about the importance of church-state separation in safeguarding religious freedom.

[Spexxvet]

Why are churches tax exempt, anyway? Anybody know? Anybody?

[Flint]

Presumably to prevent government interference in religious practice, IE discriminatory taxes.

[Stormieweather]

It's not just churches that are tax exempt. Charitable organizations, scientific organizations, religious organizations, federal credit unions, private foundations, child care organizations can all apply for tax exempt status. In order to qualify, there are strict requirements which have to be met. A 501(c)(3) organization can risk it's tax exempt status if a substantial portion of its function is lobbying for legislative change. They are absolutely prohibited from any involvement with any political campaigns. Even the leaders of a 501(c)(3) organization cannot make partisan statements at any official function and are encouraged not to do so privately as well. Political organizations such as campaigns can also apply for tax exempt status, but under a different umbrella with different requirements.

The exempt purposes set forth in IRC Section 501(c)(3) are charitable, religious, educational, scientific, literary, testing for public safety, fostering national or international amateur sports competition, and the prevention of cruelty to children or animals. The term charitable is used in its generally accepted legal sense and includes relief of the poor, the distressed, or the underprivileged; advancement of religion; advancement of education or science; erection or maintenance of public buildings, monuments, or works; lessening the burdens of government; lessening of neighborhood tensions; elimination of prejudice and discrimination; defense of human and civil rights secured by law; and combating community deterioration and juvenile delinquency.

http://www.irs.gov/charities/charita...=96099,00.html



Stormie

Originally Posted by Flint

Presumably to prevent government interference in religious practice, IE discriminatory taxes.

A flat tax would get rid of that problem.

[Happy Monkey]

Not really. Religious tax exemption predates income tax, and was originally on property tax, which is already flat (at least in my area).