Hand wringing about Jill leaving.

[BigV]

Originally Posted by DanaC

Just to be absolutely clear: though I like Jill, I don't really know her that well. I'm not oh so upset that she isn't here. I'm annoyed at the way this keeps happening. She isn't the first and she won't be the last. Reasonable people attempting to have a robust political discussion with people of varying opinions end up being subjected to personal attacks and trying to argue rationally with people who are being irrational.

That doesn't make for a fun debate.

Originally Posted by Stormieweather

I have lots to say about politics, but I won't say it here. I've observed that there is no possibility whatsoever of a reasonable political debate on these forums.

there isn't much debate going on in the Politics forum. And that's a goddamn shame. It should be renamed "Argument Clinic" or "Shouting".

I see debate as a contest of ideas, using words and ears and eyes. Also, for competitve debates where the only idea is to win we have the kinds of debaters for that but no impartial judges. but that kind of debating is to my mind NOT what the Politics forum is for, certainly not what I want in the politics forum. I want to be informed, perhaps to be persuaded. I want to learn. And that means an open mind, but there isn't much of that on display. Very little express acknowledgment that the "other side" has much valid to offer. It seems such an admission is tantamount to a sign of weakness--anathema to the current tone.

It's not just in the cellar. I see and hear it all over the place. It's just as sad there too, and just as useless.

Among my high priorities, what is good for the country ranks right up there. And I *wish* the discussions were 1 -- among people who shared such priorities, and 2 -- that there would be more listening and openmindedness as to the method by which we reach our putatively shared goals.

It's sad and frustrating.