Aikido

[bluecuracao]

I thought I'd been told that Aikido was only defensive, but maybe I'm remembering wrong--it's been a long time.

[footfootfoot]

que ir combate?

roughly: you wanna fight? but really puttin a hurt on someone

[BigV]

Ow.

I have survived my first aikido class at Tenzan Aikido. I know I survived because if I had died and gone to hell, I wouldn't hurt this bad. I fell more times last night that I have in the previous fifteen years combined. I have pains in places I didn't know I had parts. Pass the ibuprophen, please.

SonofV's class was the first hour, and my class was the second hour. We took turns watching each other's class. Actually, SonofV spent much of his non-mat hour chatting up another youngster also waiting on her parent. He was stoked (about the class time). He was singled out a couple of times for doing the drill right by Bookman Sensei, and he beamed about it on the way to the car. In fact, to emphasize his mad skilz, he asked if I wanted to see his front rolls--no, wait, watch! And in the time it took me to wrestle the car keys out of my bag, he had done about eight of them on the parking strip grass next to the car. "See?!" Wow. Very cool.

He asked when he could get a gi. I told him if he sticks with it for the month, he can have a gi. Big carrot. We signed up for one month. I signed up for unlimited practice for the month, and SonofV for a once a week pace. I may have bitten off more than I can chew. I can't imagine going three days a week, certainly not more, not now. But the difference isn't a lot of money, I don't begrudge that. I will try to use it as leverage to heave myself off my deathbed and go practice again.

I really did enjoy it, even more than I enjoy complaining about my sore muscles. The first 15-20 minutes were spent in quiet directed yoga / breathing exercises. Very very important, and useful. I liked that part. The class I was in was an All Levels class. Some (un)rank(ed) beginners like me, some with real gis and white belts, and about five with the black split skirt the name of which temporarily eludes me. I was paired with each of the advanced students, in turn, about 5-10 minutes each, and worked on some very elementary skills, many of which brought me into intimate contact with the canvas. I tell you, it's a long way down...followed immediately by a rapid deceleration. Oof.

But to watch the others, especially the... well, all of them looked graceful, powerful, beautiful. Aikido has the potential for some very smooth movements. Someday mine will be smooth too. I will not be a square wheel forever.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Well done V. I never got an explanation in biology class, just why our pain receptors seem to be concentrated in the corners. The upside of course, is that once the corners are gone, so is the pain.

[footfootfoot]

Well done. Take a look at the move at 2:10. I took a few classes with Saito Sensei during a seminar back in the day. He is pretty amazing, I don't remember him smiling much though.

[zippyt]

Foots , You goin ta let that Old man throw you around like that ???

[BigV]

I awoke this morning to stillness. Stillness of my body. I couldn't move out of bed. I felt as though I had been embalmed with concrete.

It's coming up to the end of the day and I can almost get myself in and out of my chair without help. I'm determined to get back on the pony tonight though. If by pony I mean the mat. Wish me luck.

[Griff]

You will make it dude!

When I was a bouncer I used it a lot.
That and Krav Maga.

[hideouse]

You Dwellars know about bullshit already, but for any who haven't had enough yet i'd like to take a moment to say that almost all characterizations of this or that school of martial arts instruction or style are simplistic and/or wrong. To call aikido or judo "defensive" is like calling western wrestling purely defensive. The so-called style is a tool, like a gun or a knife is a tool, and can be used aggressively or not as the practicioner pleases.
The trend to call martial ways "gentle" or paths of peace, or non-violent started after Japan lost WW2. Before that terible lesson Japanese nationlists saw these practices as ways to export Japanese culture to the barbaric aliens outside the shores of Japan.While there has long been a philosophical and meditative aspect to Japanese (and other east asian) martial arts, there origins in , and utility in bloody violence is not forgotten by their cultures of origin.
Now that i've got that out of the way, Hooray for FamilyofV for starting aikido! It can be great fun!

[Beestie]

Originally Posted by hideouse

The trend to call martial ways "gentle" or paths of peace, or non-violent started after Japan lost WW2. Before that terible lesson Japanese nationlists saw these practices as ways to export Japanese culture to the barbaric aliens outside the shores of Japan.

You're off by thirteen centuries give or take a decade or two. It started in China around 500 AD as a way for Monks to meditate, stay in shape and, when necessary, defend the monastary. And just for the record, Martial Arts in Japan and China prior to WWII were taught in closed schools to hand-picked students and it was forbidden for anyone other than the Master to teach anyone outside the school.

The exception is Korean TKD; a post WWII martial art. Korea was most interested in exporting TKD far and wide as a matter of national pride. And any black belt is sanctioned to teach and promote students.

[hideouse]

Originally Posted by hideouse

While there has long been a philosophical and meditative aspect to Japanese (and other east asian) martial arts, there origins in , and utility in bloody violence is not forgotten by their cultures of origin.

the legend of a chinese buddhist sect that practiced hand to hand combat at the same school they practiced ch'an meditation does not make all asian martial arts ways of peace. I lack the scholarly materials to definteively make a case one way or the other but I suggest that very few of the people who practiced martial arts through out history had the leisure and the security to practice for meditative or philosophical purposes. More likely in my view is that people learned how to do unto others as they were trying to do unto them. I believe that what makes the "way of peace" expression of martial arts possible is strong central government able to keep a rein on warlords and bandits with the accompaning economic prosperity that allows people time to train instead of struggling to produce enough food to eat every day.
On the other hand, every culture known has some sort of system of personal competition in the form of some sort of wrestling or boxing or hitting with implements. Why does it need to be fancier than that?

Originally Posted by hideouse

You Dwellars know about bullshit already, but for any who haven't had enough yet i'd like to take a moment to say that almost all characterizations of this or that school of martial arts instruction or style are simplistic and/or wrong. To call aikido or judo "defensive" is like calling western wrestling purely defensive. The so-called style is a tool, like a gun or a knife is a tool, and can be used aggressively or not as the practicioner pleases.
The trend to call martial ways "gentle" or paths of peace, or non-violent started after Japan lost WW2. Before that terible lesson Japanese nationlists saw these practices as ways to export Japanese culture to the barbaric aliens outside the shores of Japan.While there has long been a philosophical and meditative aspect to Japanese (and other east asian) martial arts, there origins in , and utility in bloody violence is not forgotten by their cultures of origin.
Now that i've got that out of the way, Hooray for FamilyofV for starting aikido! It can be great fun!

True... the way I used it was very different than the way it is taught in dojos across the country.
I was taught by a couple of masters, after hours, specific to my job... just practical application, enhancing what I already knew, in relation to my reflexes-body type, strength, situations, numbers of opponents, etc. They told me that in a few weeks I learned things that took others years to learn.

[MaggieL]

Originally Posted by rkzenrage

\\I was taught by a couple of masters, after hours, specific to my job... just practical application...They told me that in a few weeks I learned things that took others years to learn.

I've seen cops apply variations of some of the same techniques that are used in aikido, and the techniques themselves are not particularly difficult.

The disciplines, ideas and styles of thinking that are taught in true Aikido dojos (as opposed to those offering a smorgasbord of various arts who teach joint locks too) take a lot longer to impart.

[hideouse]

Originally Posted by MaggieL

I've seen cops apply variations of some of the same techniques that are used in aikido, and the techniques themselves are not particularly difficult.

The disciplines, ideas and styles of thinking that are taught in true Aikido dojos (as opposed to those offering a smorgasbord of various arts who teach joint locks too) take a lot longer to impart.

Given that the modern expression of aikido encompasses Gozo Shioda'a Yoshinkan, Ueshiba's aikikai, and Tomiki's shin-shin toitsu do, three extremely different ways of learning and practicing aikido, leads me to be wary of the phrase "true aikido". I think i know what you mean, but that phrase has been the source of a lot of contention.
Even Ueshiba didn't start his peace love and understanding trip until after WW2. Before the war he was notorious for injuring students. Gozo Shioda has been characterized by at least one of his students as "a vicious little shit who liked to hurt people". Tomiki has at least once broken both collarbones of a student although the story i heard he wasn't necessarily trying to.
The modern ideals bandied about modern aikido culture are worth listening to but be careful and critical of what you hear.
All the above is my opinion. There are many like it, but this one is mine. YMMV, etc.

Edit: Please forgive my ranting. I don't know what's come over me,,,