I like this guy!

[Radar]

http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j112603.html

[Kitsune]

Brave man. Even if you don't agree with him, you have to admire him taking chances on speaking out against things. Its almost a crime, these days.

My current favorite: Freeway Blogger

[FileNotFound]

Originally posted by Kitsune
Brave man. Even if you don't agree with him, you have to admire him taking chances on speaking out against things. Its almost a crime, these days.

My current favorite: Freeway Blogger

Is it?

I don't think I heard of anyone being arrested for speaking out agaisnt Dubya.

[Beestie]

I don't think I heard of anyone being arrested for speaking out agaisnt Dubya.

Matter of time before W's critics are labeled "enemy combatants" and hauled away to detention zones, denied counsul, tried in secret courts and shipped off to unnamed gulags.

I like W (which isn't to say I agree w/ him about everything) but Ashcroft and the Patriot Acts have Stalin and Lenin beaming with pride. Ashcorft's callous disregard for the rights afforded to us under the Constitution is appaling.

[FileNotFound]

Oh I agree that Asscroft is a religious fanatic determined to take away as many rights as he can. I also wrote articles on the Patriot act and the DMCA regarding how both are unconstitutional, limit our freedoms and hinder sientific development.

But I do not see anyone being arrested, not now, not tomrow.

Thus I don't see the guy as having 'guts' in speaking out against Bush.

[Kitsune]

Originally posted by FileNotFound

Is it?

I don't think I heard of anyone being arrested for speaking out agaisnt Dubya.

I'm not aware of anyone being arrested, but certainly some people have been detained for lengthy periods or put under watch for speaking out.

I can't help but find it disturbing that our country, that prides itself on freedom of speech, set up "free speech zones" that restrict peaceful protests to several city blocks away from the actual event they are protesting. The Mayor of Tampa, Pam Iorio, declared all of Tampa a "Free Speech Zone" when Bushed visited, recently. The battle between City and Federal ideas met a wonderful clash that day.

[Beestie]

Thus I don't see the guy as having 'guts' in speaking out against Bush.

Agree 100%. Just exaggerating to make a point.

And the DMCA is a classic case of legislation for cash. And speaking of which, I'm sure you heard Orin Hatch's idea (spoonfed to him by his 'owners') that the RIAA should be permitted to hack into computers suspected of pirating music. And all the while, he's running a web server using unregistered software.

The Constitution is under seige from within and without.

[vsp]

Originally posted by FileNotFound
I don't think I heard of anyone being arrested for speaking out against Dubya.

Go to one of Dubya's public appearances, carrying a sign displaying your polite, non-profane, but firmly-held displeasure with the President.

Watch as you and those expressing similar sentiments are ordered to move to a designated "First Amendment Zone," too far away to be seen or heard, while pro-Dubya attendees are allowed to remain up close.

Refuse to move, on the grounds that the entire nation is a "First Amendment Zone."

Watch what happens.

<a href="http://www.sptimes.com/2002/11/09/news_pf/Opinion/Zones_hinder_free_spe.shtml">Example one</a>

<a href="http://www.metrobeat.net/gbase/Expedite/Content?oid=oid%3A1622">Example two</a>

<a href="http://www.buzzflash.com/analysis/2002/06/17_Dictatorship.html">Example three</a>

Need more?

[FileNotFound]

Originally posted by Kitsune


I'm not aware of anyone being arrested, but certainly some people have been detained for lengthy periods or put under watch for speaking out.

I can't help but find it disturbing that our country, that prides itself on freedom of speech, set up "free speech zones" that restrict peaceful protests to several city blocks away from the actual event they are protesting. The Mayor of Tampa, Pam Iorio, declared all of Tampa a "Free Speech Zone" when Bushed visited, recently. The battle between City and Federal ideas met a wonderful clash that day.

Who has been detained?

As far as I know all that was done is that the girl was questioned (at home, the agents didn't even enter, they talked through the doorway) regarding having some pro taliban material because she had an antibush poster.

At no point did they say "YOU CANNOT HAVE THAT POSTER!" they just wanted to know if she had any ties to the taliban etc.

Not a big deal. End of story.

[Kitsune]

Originally posted by FileNotFound


At no point did they say "YOU CANNOT HAVE THAT POSTER!" they just wanted to know if she had any ties to the taliban etc.

Not a big deal. End of story.

You don't find it a big deal that The Secret Service was dispatched to someone's private residence because of a poster they had on their wall? Don't you find it even mildly disturbing that a government agency took their time to investigate an American Citizen for an anti-bush slogan?

[FileNotFound]

Originally posted by vsp


Refuse to move, on the grounds that the entire nation is a "First Amendment Zone."

Watch what happens.

Need more?

I am aware of the first amendement zones and bs in the patriot act that can label a protestor as a domestic terrorist.

YET these are NOT related to being arrested for speaking out by writing an article and posting it online.

Id say he had guts if he went protesting with that article - but he isn't.

[FileNotFound]

Originally posted by Kitsune


You don't find it a big deal that The Secret Service was dispatched to someone's private residence because of a poster they had on their wall? Don't you find it even mildly disturbing that a government agency took their time to investigate an American Citizen for an anti-bush slogan?

They were told to investigate somebody for having anti bush material.

Secret Service can't ignore tips. They backed off when they realized how timid the poster really was.

Yes it's disturbing, yes it's wrong. But it's not 1984 or even 10 years ago Soviet Russia.

[Kitsune]

Originally posted by FileNotFound
Yes it's disturbing, yes it's wrong. But it's not 1984 or even 10 years ago Soviet Russia.

I agree that it isn't a huge deal, but I also don't agree with the tactics being used on citizens for things that aren't true threats. The mere fact that anyone is being reviewed for speaking out against an elected official bothers me. It is your legal right to do this and you shouldn't have to live in fear that someone is going to come knocking at your door to find out why you did it.

[Kitsune]

Originally posted by FileNotFound

YET these are NOT related to being arrested for speaking out by writing an article and posting it online.

Id say he had guts if he went protesting with that article - but he isn't.

I only said that because, well, if The Secret Service will come to your door for having a poster on your wall, then what kind of scrutiny will you be held to for having published something on the web for the entire world to see?

[vsp]

Originally posted by FileNotFound
I am aware of the first amendement zones and bs in the patriot act that can label a protestor as a domestic terrorist.

YET these are NOT related to being arrested for speaking out by writing an article and posting it online.

Id say he had guts if he went protesting with that article - but he isn't.

Protesting is protesting, whether it's online or in-person.
You don't think that the FBI file on the author didn't just get a little wider?

It's one thing for them to thoroughly follow-up on reports of actual threats towards the President. When I worked for the sysadmins at N.C. State, we had a Secret Service visit when one of our conservative students became overagitated by the election of Bill Clinton, and posted a twelve-word exclamation to a USENET newsgroup. (Six words were "Clinton," three were "Fuck" and three were "Kill." Arranging them into the proper configuration is left as an exercise for the reader.) The mere presence of the word "Kill" in proximity to the President-elect's name was enough to trigger Secret Service radar, and they had a little chat with the student in question.

It's quite another to interpret non-violent anti-Bush (or anti-war) statements, actions or paraphrenalia as a direct threat to the President, worthy of <a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2003/11/23/national/23FBI.html?ex=1070551431&ei=1&en=b52559fd569640f5">monitoring by the FBI</a>, investigation by the Secret Service (the aforementioned girl-with-a-poster), or even temporary denial of basic Constitutional rights (freedom of assembly, freedom of speech, from the examples I provided). Anti-Bush material is NOT A CRIME, nor even remotely close to being one.

Unfortunately, there are plenty of people out there who mistake anti-Bush or anti-war sentiments for <a href="http://www.amarillo.com/stories/120303/opi_letters.shtml">anti-Americanism</a> or worse.